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Baby step comments to hint for the number
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 29, 2011
186 comments
I do something with the first people I see for the day to begin my social momentum for the day. As I was getting closer to the bus stop, I saw two girls. One was facing my direction and the other was facing the first girl, away from me. As I got up to the stop, I simply smiled and said “Hello” to the girl facing me.
“Hello” said the one facing me as her friend turned around to see who she was saying hi to. When the second girl turned, [private] she said “Hi” as well, to which I smiled. As I said, I was just greeting the girls to begin the social momentum for the day. There was nothing striking about them, so I just greeted them and left it at that.
As I got on the bus I could see three seats in a row, each with a girl sitting on the inside seat, leaving the outside one open. A quick scan had me take the seat with the cutest of the three, whom I sat next to.
She was wearing headphones, so I waited a few moments then I turned to her, smiled and asked if she knew which stop it was that the Pru was on (yes I knew this, but I was using the situational questions to feel her out). She explained the stop was Copley so I thanked her, gazed at her face for a moment and smiled. She put her earphones back on and went back to her music. I waited a few more beats of time to go by and I turned to her again.
“What color train is that stop on?” I asked her. She told me ‘green’ then asked me if I was new in town. When a girl asks any question about me, it is a signal of curiosity to know more about me and keep the conversation going.
So I went into my elaborate story of how I am from this area, yet I travel so much. I tell her of my last trip to Puerto Rico lasting 7 months longer than I first thought I would stay, then I went on to tell her about the beauty of the place, the friendliness of the people, the tropical animals and my practice in real-life Spanish.
I talked about the food there, and our conversation transitioned to trading stories about different ethnic restaurants in town. She described a Colombian restaurant she liked (which I noted in my head) and I told her how I love to meet up with friends at different spots to split appetizers. This was about 10 minutes since I first spoke to her.
Our conversation was flowing smoothly, back and forth. I could detect her interest in me and I thought she was cool to talk to. I gauged how many stops were left before I’d have to get off and I said to her: “You seem like you have a really cool energy, it’s a shame we can only enjoy each other’s company for the length of this bus ride.” She expressed agreement in smiles and nodding and small comments. I paused to let it sink in; I even looked away for a moment in thought.
Then I turned back to her. “I wonder what steps we’d need to take to pick this conversation up another time” and I let it sink in while she thought of ways two people could connect later. Trade info, exchange numbers, etc.
Then as if I was hit with a discovery I said. “Ya, we should definitely trade info so we can talk again another time” as I pulled out my cell phone. It never seems awkward when I take baby steps to this type of suggestion, just like the expected normal thing to happen next. I have found that by signaling my way up to the number seemed to be easily accepted and replied well to. It wasn’t an all-of-a-sudden: ‘Let me get your number’ out of nowhere in the conversation. I showed where I was going as if it was the natural next step. I also take the asking for anything out of the picture. I don’t ask for numbers, I suggest we trade information. More even exchange, less pressure.
My favorite part when I do things this way is when I start to suggest, sometimes the girl will have the idea: “Oh ya, give me your number.” Or whatever. This seems to drop the flake factor and have her more invested into waiting for/getting my call too. Not all girls do this, they still are humble feminine creatures but it is cool when they do, usually the outgoing ones.
So I pull out my phone to her.
“What is it?” I asked with my cell phone in hand as I selected ‘new contact’ on my phone.
“Jenna.” She told me.
“No your number. I have to punch that in first, then I can put your name to it.” I said. We hadn’t even traded names yet.
She told me her number; I punched it in and put ‘Jenna’ in the name section. “Ok, I will send you a text right now with my name in it so you can save the number. I’m C.J.” and I sent her a text right then. I could see my call coming through, now knowing it is a real number she gave (we had clicked pretty well so I had no reason to think it wouldn’t be but it is a habit) and she saved the number with my name to it.
We kept chatting and she subtly mentioned her brother & his speaking English. “Where is your family from?” I asked. Even when girls make small subtle points, they are stepping stones for more information, further conversation, getting to know each other better.
“Nicaragua.” She said.
“No kidding, como estas?” I had to ask, practicing my Spanish once again. “You can be my Spanish practice buddy.” (I do usually hint at girls getting stuck in my friend-zone if they don’t play their cards right. Here is another frame that I found by owning it first, I never get stuck in.)
She then told me she was riding the green line too and would be coming with me since her stop was one after mine. We boarded the train, chatting for the ride, when I got to my stop, I took her arm for a small squeeze and told her I would talk to her later.
To keep whatever emotional high she was in from meeting me, I sent her a text about an hour later: “Hey Jenna, now I am all curious about the Colombian place you told me of. We’ll have to go split appetizers when we both have time free. C.J.”
…and 20 minutes later I get her text back: “Definitely! =)”
[/private]
Transcript sent from student about coaching (through girl as guest to party situation)
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 28, 2011
No comments
me: my friend is having a small party tonight and i have a girl coming with me
how shouls i go about the nigh
im good at night game at big parties where its mostly grinding but im not so confident about a small house party
hey so she just asked me if she can bring friends
she has an annoying cockblock friend
whats a good way of telling her she cant?
cj: ur friends party, ur allowed to bring 1 guest
me: duh…
thanks
idk why i walways miss the simple stuff
she said ohh well i promised my firend ill go out with her tonight
cj: if you want her 2 come with cockblcok friend… tell her you’ll check with ur friend to make an axception. then wait a bit and tell her only one friend… that is if u want cockblock. myself, i would blow it off as in ok we’ll make it another night… to girl than later tell her what a phenomenal fun she missed. shows take her or leave her attitude and that she needs to make special accomodations 4 u which girls will do once you get their attarction/rap
me: she actually menioned another friend who im good with and shouldnt be a paroblem
cj: generally its best to stand your ground
she may be testing yoy if she sees u switch original stand u may come across as too supplicating… which is not attractive to girls
once i made a statement i stick to it
she then knows she has to accomodate to guy (what girls like to do) not guy aaccomomdating to her( girls find unattractive and too needy)… sticking toguns now may lead to more deeper attraction next time… u have girls all over your life. if sheis lucky enough for a chance to hang with u she learns to accomodate to what offers u give her
me: thanks
im at this girls place we were studying and now were watching a movie
i tried to escalate but she went to the kitchen and then went to sit on another couch
what can i do now
cj: well, your there now?
me: yes
cj: have u escalated before w/ her?
me: i tried she was ok with itfor a little but then she went to the kitchen and sat on another couch when she cme back
cj: sometimes i may say hey come sit here ( happily and patting place next to you) i want to show you somethinglike palm reading…
me: idk plam reading
what else can i use
cj: take her hand she her one of the lines on her palm and tell her it is a river. then pointide of the rivertell her there is an apple tree on that side of the river. then pint to the other side (you are holding her hand in yours this whole time)
and tell her bob and sue are on the other side of the river
then ask her how do bob and sue get across the frozen river to pick an apple
she’ll probably say they’ll walk the river is frozen
then you say if the river is frozen then its winter and there are no apples
you both can laught at thesilly joke but now you’ve been holding her hand for some time put it down after the joke but she should be morewarmed up to slow escalation at least off handed affection
me: i di that and she didnt find it funny and went back to her seat
cj: we’ll practice your deliverywhen we meetup again. she may be in ana off mood but who knows. if she was fine, then something crossed her mind to change things…
depending on her mood, i might tellher that she seems a little stressed, she should sit on floor in fornt of me between legs so i can rub her shoulders
like everything, may work or may not but u never know till u try. are u guys talking about stuff… do u know to seduce in conversation
me: no how do i do that
cj: first i like to bring up an imagination topic, to free up both of our minds if you couldwake tmrw anywhere in the world where would it be
then she tells me. i ask her why what about the place drew herto pick it
then sensually talk about all the details sights sounds smells of foodfeelings of temperaturetasted of foods theream imagination plane then maybe play in her imagination
ok if we were there tomorrow what the first thing we could do then talk about exploring the placetogether
the ni might say you know those fleeting moments when you feel truely alive while looking at herknowingly with a smirk
i love these moments
do you remember a time that everything was absoloutly prfect and you felt on top of the world
then id ask her to decribe that time while off handedly touching her while i was asking her for detailsadding on to her descriptions
id watch her face while she talks… not even so much on the eyes but roaming around her face her shoulders her neck then back to her face
every so often while she is talking i would look at her face stop my gaze lick my own as i imagined kissing her then back to listening
every time i spoke it would be lowand deep words spoken slowly elongating the vowels pronouncng carefully even when i was speakingi might gaze around her face pasue on her lips and pause mid sentence of what i was saying lick my bottom lip then keep talking
me: tha nks
her roomates just showed up so imight need to hold off on that till tomorrow
cj: that might have been why she held off to prevent things getting too hot then having her roommated walk in
girls do that if she guessed when they’s be back
RE: Two ways to be attractive to women
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 26, 2011
468 comments
Siege
Day GSF Organizer
Posts: 342
Likes Received: 9 in 9 posts
RE: Two ways to be attractive to women
(Today 12:28 AM)Grim Wrote:
Using other people words to convince a women you are genuine and real
Using routines that convince her the interaction is spontaneous
Lying and telling her that you are something or someone you are not
The thing is, having seen guys on both sides oif the coin, guys who rely on (above) don’t seem to get much if any increase in self worth, self value, self esteem.
It is like they know that it is the fake persona that gets women’s attention, gets laid, is loved…not the real person, themselves underneath it all.
Grim Wrote:
And every guy I have met that has clung to these methods starts to secretly hate himself. Because his perception of his outer reality – as a guy who is successful with women – is completely at odds with the old loser who never changed.
I wont even mention an age old, so called ‘guru’ that I saw & spoke to at the world summit that still shows he is struggling with that deficiency in life.
There in even a photo of one of his convos, here in the forum, that shows evidence of a hollow self awarness, self esteem.
Grim Wrote:
In the long run, being disingenuous pretty much disqualifies you from long term meaningful relationships. Women are intuitive and unless she is very naive she will see through you and despise you for it. It’s a recipe to have every relationship in your life fail.
But then on the shiney side of this coin:
Griim Wrote:
The other way?
It requires you to make deep internal changes. These are very uncomfortable changes because it means admitting that your old self is unattractive to women. It means saying goodbye to who you are and moving into completely unknown territory. But just because the path is dark, doesn’t mean it won’t lead to a good place.
So which path takes longer? The second for sure. It requires much more effort. It is more gut wrenching to your soul. But here’s the kicker. When you work towards becoming the type of man women want to date, having these women come into you life is effortless. All your effort pays off on the second path. It becomes easier to date the type of women you want to be with.
Another great point I see within your post, is that by doing the second way, you go on to develop and grow parts of your life all along this.
Parts that have no direct relation to women but still continuously fulfill and satisfy on a regular basis.
Designing a life of choice ratheer than by chance is anothe one of the things i am so ultimatly thankful for.
Grim Wrote:
On the second path women find you, they want to date you. You keep women around longer because they know the genuine you and are comfortable with you. You are comfortable with yourself. Women see this and sense this. And they love this, intensely in the short term and warmly in the long term.
And I thank you, Mr Grim for explaining these points within thiss post.
About 3 weeks ago, an ex-sripper & every-so-often gf of mine (first before 2000) just touch base back into my life.
Not only does that bring back her energy which I enjoy, I secretly am proud of standing above the guys she has dated between our times together.
HALLOWEEN/VEGAS Coach/Wing Wknd BONANZA!!!
You too, stay at Project Vegas Mansion w/ 4 coaches incl. PM/Txt 4 info. 3 left
[txt: C.J. "The Siege" @ 857-544-1943]
LINKS:
VEGAS HALLOWEEN Wing/Coach WKND
And
FREE Dating/PUA Instruction
Facebook d’Adventures HERE
Quote this movie:
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 26, 2011
1 comment
“It doesn’t have to make sense, it’s just something that happens, it’s like seeing someone for the first time,[private] you could be passing on the street and you look at each other for a few seconds and there is a recognition you both know something. Then they’re gone and it’s too late to do anything about it and you always remember it because it was there and you let it go, and you tell yourself what if I had stopped, what if I had said something, what if…it may only happen a few times in your life” [/private]doesn’t have to make sense
Please establish a good precedent for new guys a’board ship
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 24, 2011
1 comment
Today, 06:50 AM (This post was last modified: Today 06:58 AM by Siege.)
Post: #1
Siege Offline
Day GSF Organizer
****
Posts: 429
Likes Given: 45
Likes Received: 21 in 19 posts
Joined: Oct 2010
Reputation: 7
Warning Level: 0%
Please establish a good precedent for new guys a’board ship
[insert]
(Today 06:50 AM)Siege Wrote: [insert]
Serendipitous Wrote:Siege, bringing up a bunch of Achilles threads is not productive to making the forum a more hospitable environment. Therefore I’ll continue to lock the threads you bring up, especially when you’ve made four posts in a row now and people here want to move on now.
” and people here want to move on now.”
You are only one person. Please speak as such to be accurate.
All Written By C.J. “The Siege” © 2010/2011, all rights reserved.
Achilles Appreciation Thread HERE
Facebook C.J. HERE,
and yes: PLEASE feel free to call/text 857-544-1943 24hrs
Reply to girl’s comment:
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 23, 2011
415 comments
“I wondered what kind of depth you’re aiming for… all the one night stand business. Who wants a one night stand? What we really want is an ongoing relationship that’s smoking hot. No?” ~Sheila R
“Where do you see reference to ‘one night stand’? Even myself, never even did that. Waitaminnit there was one time, just after high school…and I would have called her again if I had her number, she was super cool. But alas, didn’t have her number after that night chemistry and primal attraction had us enjoying each other more elaborately than a handshake, So yes, Sheila R., please clarify.” ~C.J. “The Siege”
Women
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 23, 2011
236 comments
[private]Women.
I love the way the look, I love the way they smell. I love those times when two dimples happen above a girls waist.
Some girls have the sweetest voices, others have the sexiest voices. I like how they’re humble and graceful and usually polite.
AND I totally DO LOVE hearing about how they look at the world, been that way since I was 5
.[/private]
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 20, 2011
1 comment
Siege Offline
Day GSF Organizer
****
Posts: 430
Likes Given: 45
Likes Received: 21 in 19 posts
Joined: Oct 2010
Reputation: 7
Warning Level: 0%
RE: Siege’s adventures, games & puzzles
LR – Token LMR & 1st kiss her at my place
(this was written when lair was down, so here it is now)
previously Wrote:
by The Siege
So it all started at Allston bar/grill, Sunset Grill. I was there a little early to be meeting some friends there for dinner. The waitress gave me a table beeper and I sat at the bar to wait for my friends. I was sitting on the corner of the bar and on the adjacent side of the bar were 4 girls in a row. I eye contacted with a smile the two that were closest to me.
As soon as the girl closest to me got her drink, we talked about her beer a bit. We mad some jokes about beers. To explain her reasons to be out on a weeknight, she says that she and her friends ran the marathon that day, so even though I only partially believe her (based on her delivery) I play along with her joke.
I scan across the row of girls and notice the one farthest from me, the youngest and the cutest of the bunch is doing some eye contact flirting heavily but is much more reserved than the other 3 girls.
The first girl then points out each girl in the row and tells me of something that was significant about them in the marathon simultaneously doing a mini-intro without names. She tells me one girl had a knee go out in the last 2 miles, that she personally had stomach ache during part of the race and small factors about each one during the race. It seems as if she is making the whole thing up, but I play along for playful sake.
At one point she is playing with her phone and I see an engagement/wedding band on the indicator finger. She was wicked fun to talk & joke with, so I just noted it in my head & went on with the convo. My first buddy shows up. After a few minutes of catch up talk, I quickly introduce him in to the girls. I use the same intro the first girl did with me when she introduced me to the group.
I started announcing the group to my buddy as an introduction. “Ya, and these girls ran the marathon today. This girl had a stomach-ache, This girl a knee problem…” I began with…. and the first girl finished my introduction to my buddy with the specifics she told me previously. She finished up the introductions.
Conversation went on with me, my buddy & mostly the girl closest to us and a little less with next girl over and even less with the 3rd girl in the group.( Nothing but gazes from the last girl in the row.) At one point the second girl in the row mentioned her husband offhandedly in a comment so I made my second note in my head. The girls were fun to chat with, so it kept going on for a few minutes until their appetizers came.
As the first 3 girls were eating their appetizers, I saw the last girl in the row, the one making her heavy eye contact flirts. She had no appetizer and was just sitting with her drink. She was blond, very cute & definitely caught my attention. She had a rocker chick vibe which has caught & held my attention more than once. I excused myself from my buddy, walked down the bar to where this last girl was sitting and started talking. I first was talking about the marathon again and this girl mentioned that she didn’t even go, she told me the other things she did that day.
The conversation jumps from that to places she’s worked in the past, her love for snowboarding, her origin of a different state. She tells me of her parents, her studies in school. She also tells me what she loves about her studies although her line of work was nothing even closely related. She is getting really excitedly passionate explaining these things, which I find very attractive. I still wasn’t thinking of her as much more than a cool chick to be talking to at the time. As far kino was concerned, the only touching I do is basic offhanded touches that goes easily in any conversation.
We get pretty involved in conversation as I see her getting more interested. She is turning her chair more away from the bar and more towards me and getting excited about the topics she mentioned that I asked her more about as she was elaborating. She was getting excited in her topics and was fun listening to her telling her stories this way. Seeing her interest and energy raising, I point out my friend who diagonally across the bar to point him out to her. I tell her that I think she is wicked cool but I have to get back to my friend (another way to roll out on a high point), we are waiting for another friend before getting a table.
“Oh we should totally trade contact so we can pick this up another time.” I tell her. She agrees and takes out her phone as I was taking out mine. I tell her my information and tell her to call her number through so I have it for later. Then I select her call, select ‘Add to contacts” and hand her my phone telling her to type in the information so I have it saved. She does this and while I am saving it we get into other conversations.
We then talk more about where she was from, what she studied in college and her love for snowboarding and her 3 month trip in the past winter. The conversation was still rolling along nicely so I stayed in it for a few minutes before getting back to my friend. As I start to walk away from her, I turn back and tell her that my friend and I are waiting for another chick friend and then we are getting a table. I tell her as soon as our other friend arrives that she should join us at the table too. She says it sounds good so I tell her I will let her know when I get buzzed for the table.
I go back to my buddy, our other chick friend arrived and I get buzzed for the table. Before sitting down, I go back to HBsnowboard and tell her I just got buzzed for the table. She tells me she is going to the bathroom and will be over after.
So my two friends and I go sit at our new table. We sit and are chatting and laughing along. This new table was on a totally opposite side of the restaurant but a few minutes later I see HBsnowboard coming in the dining room and making her way over. My buddy and chick friend were on the other side of the table so the available seat was on the bench seating next to me where she sat down.
We all ordered and talk and laugh for the next 2 hours or so. We really were just a table of pals chatting it up over dinner, with a new pal involved. Turns out, this girl was not with the other 3 at the bar, she just met them and were insta-friended by them.
All sorts of things come up in our conversation. When I bring up off handed topics of sex, we talk of wacky places to have sex. Then she tells me that she lost her virginity twice. First was with two other girls, then a different time with a guy. We talk of the way Joey Lauren Adams character in ‘Chasing Amy’ explained concepts related to losing virginity and the differences between girl/boy sex and girl/girl sex.
This new girl fit right in with our conversations and everything went along great. I excused myself at one point after dinner to have a smoke and new girl said she was coming with me to smoke as well. While we were outside, I asked her about the hookah bars nearby. Once I learned she liked them, I told her of my hookah at my house.
She told me of her day & of her two roommates. One was a guy and the other was girl who didn’t really like each other. She told me she was a mediator between the two at times. While we were chatting outside, I asked her what she was doing the next day and she told me nothing. I mentioned going back to my place after dinner to smoke hookah and told her she was welcome to come along. She then remembered she was supposed to meet her guy roommate at a nearby bar for a few but said she would skip that since she was having fun with me and could catch up to him later.
We went back inside, had a few more drinks. My buddy had to leave early since he had an NY trip in the following morning so HBsnowboard, my chick friend and myself stayed for another round chatting and laughing. We all paid the bill, I hugged my chick friend goodbye and HBsnowboard and her exchanged “nice meeting you”s with each other.
I first was ready to shoot back to my place with HBsnowboard to smoke some hookah when she tells me that she now has to go to the nearby bar to check on her guy roommate and touch base with him…this was the same one she decided to skip meeting with earlier when it came up. She tells me this and I say nothing, I just look at her. She then then tells me I can come too if I want.
“Alright, why not. That’s a fun bar, I’ll hang for a little bit.”
Sure I could have let her go or said bye or even tried to give her address or directions to my house but I know from prior experience what happens. Her attraction drops, the rapport is temporarily forgotten and a girl will get wrapped up in a new activity. She will be wrapped in the moments and not make it to after plans. I was having fun & came along to the nearby bar she was meeting her roommate at.
HBsnowboard and I go inside. I go up to the bar ahead of her and order a diet coke. She comes up behind me and orders her drink. We chat some more for a while till she sees her guy roommate across the bar and waves to him. A minute or two later, she tells me she is going over to say hi to him. On her second step away, she tells me I should come too. I tell her ok and let her walk over there by herself. I finish my coke and watch TV for a few minutes where I was.
I do that for her to have the first few minutes with her roommate to catch up with whatever without me there yet. After a few minutes, I wander over to them, sit in the stool on the other side of her and then get introduced. I had some small talk with roommate and let them chat about whatever they were chatting about. When it died down a bit, I pick up conversation with HBsnowboard from topics we talked about earlier in the night. Once she was done with her drink, she indicated she wanted to leave the bar so we said bye to her roommate and went to the bustop to go to my place. I stilll haven’t kissed her at all.
Once we got there, I showed her different things around my place. We talked of where some of the decorating ideas came from and talked about different framed pieces on the walls. At one point while talking about a wall of framed photos, she points to a single one with a sexual theme and says to me: “I like that one”
Hearing her say this, I am watching her face as she does. When she finishes speaking I pull her close and start kissing her for first time, full make out. With many girls I kiss them the first time when we’re already back to my place. Before that it was nothing but offhanded touches in convo and hints dropped by me to them. Enough sexual tension can be built with conversation alone that timing gets to be crucial here. We made out for a few minutes in this hallway. I stopped this after a few and kept talking about the art on the walls and directed her to come with me to see another piece. This piece was in my bedroom. We talked about it for a minute then I pulled her to me again and started kissing her.
With two steps away, I moved us over and fell with her on my bed to keep making out. This went on for about 10 minutes. I was rubbing the sides of her body and rubbing the skin of her back and stomach under her shirt. Once I reached around to unhook her bra, she stopped me, sat up and told me that we just met.
I playfully pushed her back and said “I know it, cut it out.” in a playful smirk. I then stood up, took her hand and said “Come with me.” As I took her back in the living room, I put some music on. I asked if she wanted a glass of water and got her and myself one. We talked for a while and listened to music. She edged her seat on the couch to be tiny bit closer to me so I put my arm around her and started making out again. We made out for a while, and I stopped it to change the radio. I just went easily back into a completely unrelated topic every so often. Then I would bring it back to escalating again.
At one point she half jokingly told me she thought I was a gentleman, that she didn’t expect all this. I told her I never claimed to be gentle with a smirk on my face. I then told her I was attracted to her and asked her: “What’s wrong with that?” She shyly told me nothing. I told her that I didn’t think so either.
A little later I told her I wanted to give each other backrubs. I unfolded the futon and told her I wanted the backrub first. She told me she didn’t think she could do it well and I told her I was open to see what she could do.
I took off my shirt, lied down and she straddled me sitting on my ass. After a few minutes, I told her she wasn’t that good (jokingly but not joking at the same time). I then told her to get off of me so she could lie down and I show her how a backrub is supposed to feel.
She does that, and I start to rub the back of her shirt. After a minute, I tell her to take off the shirt and she does that. As soon as the shirt is off I unhook her bra. Then I rub her back for a while before moving to her sides and teasing the sides of her boobs. I also lean in really close to her, pausing rubbing her back to breath in around her neck and smell her hair so she can feel the air rushing as I can inhale her scents.
She is wearing nylons under her skirt. I go to pull her skirt down and she asks me “What are you doing?”
Rather than explain the obvious, I just tell her. “Take this off” as I press the waist of her skirt to show her what I mean. She does that. Previously doing things like that, I thought I had to continue the thread of giving a harmless backrub. Now understanding how girls think in a moment-to-moment basis, I know once she has gon along with having the skirt off, she is in a new moment with a new objective. Once she has it off, I turn her over to her back and we continue making out of a while. I am in no rush. I enjoy making out with her and I have learned that sometimes the longer amount of time between steps faces less resistance… while sometimes trying to get too many steps in succession increases the likelihood of resistance. This lets me get her really hot with lots of slow sensual touches…I enjoy this. A few more minutes go by & I then feel her hands fiddling with my belt buckle. I show her how it works and then take it off myself.
After 10 minutes or more, I go to pull her nylons down. As I just start to put my fingers under the waist band. She feels this and takes the nylons and her panties off herself…
All Written By C.J. “The Siege” © 2010/2011, all rights reserved.
Achilles Appreciation Thread HERE
Facebook C.J. HERE,
and yes: PLEASE feel free to call/text 857-544-1943 24hrs
Strip club Date.2
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 16, 2011
869 comments
Warning Level: 0%
RE: Strip club date
(10-01-2011 10:54 AM)mishazlair Wrote:
Is it generally a good or bad idea to take a girl to a strip club on a date? On one hand it’s a very sexual place which as a whole devalues a particular set of values in a woman. on the other hand… Maybe there are no other hands. What are your thoughts and experiences on this.
I think it depends on the girl. Some girls are curious about the whole thing and may want to have an excuse (to be there with a guy) to see what it is like at a strip club.
I definitely wouldn’t do this as a surprise date but it reminds me of a snowboard/artist girl in VT.
HBVT was super curious about a place with peep-show roll up windows. The window would roll up to see a stripper dancing & after a few minutes it would roll back down again until you put more money in the machine.
Initially thinking she just wanted to see the place, it turned out she wanted to make-out in the booth when the window went down. On first impression. she looked WAY too innocent than this, photo on my facebook.
Another time, while in NY hotel, rooftop bar with Neptune, I met a girl HBNYyoga who was super adventurous and all over the place. We went to make-out a bit in hotel elevator but she was very hesitant.
We rolled in & out together for the hotel night but there was something a bit detached I could detect. She looked more adventurous on first glance. Her photo is in my facebbok too, boy do I now hate the hat I was wearing that night.
When Neptune & I were going from there to strip club she wanted to come along. As soon as we walked in, the first thing HBNYyoga wanted to do was buy me a lap-dance and watch. Helping her to select the girl I liked best, HBNYyoga marched right up to dancer and explained what she wanted.
We did that, I sat down in lap-dance chair & with 20 min of conversation with dancer I was able to quickly jump to comfort (u don’t need much attraction in stripper game) and number close dancer with a ‘study-date’ (she was also student) scheduled for later that week.
Each girl is completely different & much can be discovered and capitalized on within the conversations.
HBNYyoga wanted strip club first night meeting & HBVT was on date out after first meeting & conversation to determine this.
So personally, I wouldn’t surprise a girl with a strip-club date, but if u find out her perception of the whole thing before taking her there, it can be a whole lot of fun..IMHO.
[txt 857-544-1943]
Strip club date
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 16, 2011
936 comments
As I am replying to this specifically:
(10-01-2011 10:54 AM)mishazlair Wrote:
Is it generally a good or bad idea to take a girl to a strip club on a date? On one hand it’s a very sexual place which as a whole devalues a particular set of values in a woman. on the other hand… Maybe there are no other hands. What are your thoughts and experiences on this.
The thought rolled around in my head for a while and other prior situations popped up in my mind.
A girl, HBCarSales that I was monogamous w/ years ago, came to me months after dating & asked me to take her to Zachary’s (cheezy strip club on Cape).
From then on, in the times I had mentioned the “I once had a gf that asked me…’ story to other girls, I was surprised to find out the inner-adventurousness in them. (“sounds like fun”, “I want to go to one”, etc) This has frequently been with girls you’d never expect to have these curiosities or girls that never tried these things before.
Then more recently HBbanker of last summer danced on my stripper pole (knowing she was on video too ) after saying she never would do such an outrageous thing.
Then again, she was the same girl who first said she could never do ‘open relationship’ but was fine with it as long as she didn’t hear about other girls. I always made her feel as the only girl on earth in the moments we shared.
Another surprise came with HBLawyer of my FR/LR a few months ago that DSmoothMike was around for that led to this:
A SNH started with stripper pole dancing. You see, it first surprised me when, she was revealing her dream was to dance as a stripper from some leading convo things from me. Upon hearing that, I brought her to my place & let her use my stripper pole. ( like i just posted another quick vid of girl on facebook, link in my sig’ntre.)
Many girls I’ve talked to seem to want to go to something like that once in their life, to see what it’s like.
Others that have a very proper, innocent appearance to the rest of the world have a real dirty side that they keep shielded from rest of world (re:Russian stu/model of Octoberfest this past Sunday. )
Many guys limit themselves & the possibilities by either (wrongly too conservative) assumed expectations …. or their desire to really want a pure, innocent girl.
When girls detect expectation to be ‘good’ in guys they like, girls will display the ‘proper’ behavior & appearance they have been brought up to show most of the world.
Once a girl (even the prim & proper looking ones) knows that no judgement will fall back on her from a guy & her adventurousness is appreciated by him, she can feel truly free with him.
She can feel like she can be truly herself, no matter what & still be accepted and approved of.
She can feel free to drop her need to look proper and dignified by the rest of society’s standards imposed.
On a few different levels, once u show them what is acceptable to your world, a whole new realm of possibilities unfolds.
Once you can clearly (yet subtly at times) indicate that it is ok for her to have a wild side, and sexual freedom is approved and welcomed by you, girls often have wonderful surprises in this department to bring to the table even if they never explored them before…
That being said, strip-club is not a kind of ‘Surprise-date’ to bring a new girl on, but many underlying desires in her can be discovered first in conversation before enjoying these things together.
Only typing what I have time for right now mishazlair, I’d love to fully elaborate about these fun parts of my life & explain what conversations led to what in discussions. Feel free to contact me, my # is in my profile. We’ll do coffee or something
(p.s. I had to star this post, I’ve always had a soft spot for strippers in general & the inner adventurousness in most girls that they never share with the rest of the world until they feel they are allowed)
How to Become Fearless to Approach Anxiety
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 12, 2011
1,164 comments
Re: Answers
[[[What sticking points would you like to overcome?
I would like to overcome approach anxiety.]]]
The best way to make it go away is to keep opening. Here is an assignment: Open 3 new conversations per day. To keep yourself accountable, open a new SMS message to yourself each day. Write 1. 2. 3. in there. Then you have a place to write a few notes about each convo & make sure you fill up all 3. If you use email to yourself, & send me copy of email, Those notes will help you remember convos for me to help you in follow up.
[[[What would you most like to learn about?
I would like to learn how to become a guy that can just approach any women fearlessly and have great success.]]]
Once you get the conversation opening to be regular, I can teach you things to get most dramatic results in quickest time., Those too also become habits that bring great things with women all the time into your life.
~C.J.
on dates = Your activities should be multi faceted.
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 12, 2011
140 comments
Bar hopping is okay, but it is much cooler to go for coffee then a walk through the park and then a museum then get ice cream then hit a bar.
“Where should I take her on the date?”
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 11, 2011
1 comment
“I apologize to you if I don’t seem real eager to jump into a forced, awkward intimate situation that people like to call dating. I don’t like the feeling.”
“You’re sitting there, you’re wondering, “Do I have food on my face? Am I eating? Am I talking too much? Are they talking enough? Am I interested? I’m not really interested. Should I play like I’m interested?”
“But I’m not that interested, but I think she might be interested. But do I want to be interested? But now she’s not interested.”
“So now, all of sudden I’m…I’m starting to get interested.”
“And when am I supposed to kiss her? Do I have to wait for the door? Cause then it’s awkward, it’s like “Well, good night.” Do you do like the ass-out hug? Where you like… you hug each other like this, and the ass sticks out because you’re trying not to get too close.”
“Or do you go right in and just kiss ‘em on the lips or don’t kiss ‘em at all?”
“It’s very difficult trying to read the situation and all the while you’re just really wondering, “Are we gonna get hopped up enough to make some bad decisions?” And perhaps play a little game called “Just the Tip.”
“Just for a second, just to see how it feels,”
“…or “Ouch Ouch, You’re on My Hair.””
(Wedding Crashers)
Which is part of the reason I never recommend dinner/movie dates. Especially on a first date. How much are you going to learn[private] about this girl while you are both silent in a movie theatre? Ok, dinner? See above.
Just by doing something that you both will have a great time being a part of will increase your bond. Here are a few ideas that stepped above the dinner/movie box:
- Going to a comedy show.
-
- Going to a museum (art, natural history, science, music, cultural, Henry Ford, Rock & Roll Hall of Fame, etc.) or checking out an exhibit at a local art gallery.
- Seeing live music. High energy, heart pumping activities are always a good bet.
- Going on a haunted hay ride a scary attraction. Fear is a big aphrodisiac.
- Going to indoor rock climbing together
- Going to a convention in the area (sci-fi/fantasy, tattoo/piercing, comic book, anime, etc.)
- Going zorbing/sphering. (I think they’re still doing that at Mt. Brighton.)
- Skycoaster is a huge adrenaline rush you can go on tandem to experience together.
- Going on a zip line ride at an area park.
- Museums usually inspire conversations on all sorts of levels. I usually mock couplehood like we are a couple of old folk tourists.
- Going sledding or on a toboggan run. It’s great to feel like a couple of kids together. [/private]
When the chemistry is right, how a SDL can capture the magic of the moment. (Thanks to Michelle for starting to transcribe through my hours worth of audios taped over the last 10 years,,sometimes I still miss those micro-cassette recorders. xo.me.)
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 10, 2011
371 comments
“Ahhh, excuse me Miss ‘Way-to-Awkwardly-Forward’…would it be too much trouble for you…I mean, if you get just a split-second of your time free, while we’re standing here chatting…could you just do me the itsy-bits favor….if it’s not too much trouble…could you please…even ‘pretty-please’ from the kindness of your ever-loving heart…could you PLEASE ASK YOU BOOBS TO STOP STARING AT MY EYES and at least take a breath…I mean, I don’t know if they were under the impression that today was the annual Wintertime HEADLIGHT IN MY FACE staring challenge…but..um….I’ve got some integrals to be figuring before calculus lab at Three O’Clock…and that is a mere TWO HOURS from now….so ya, now that you mention it, coffee might be nice right’a’bout now. I thank you..I take mine ‘Extra-Black’ and ….heh-heh, I do take my coffee as I take my women you know: “Way too Hott & in a paper cup”. Thanks. They call me: C.J….what are you called…at? I mean..Number, what number do I reach you later at if the coffee-date goes phenomenally and we realize we have an incredible time, an incredible connection…I mean when that sort of seemingly fleeting moment happens to find us immersed within it, we don’t seem to think too much about logistics regarding the whole thing…You Know all: “Caught in a moment” together. What if when that happens neither of us think to trade contact and we wander our separate ways…THEN, what if….ya we never talk again. what we could have been if we just let go in full surrender to what fate has presented us with: Each other. but what? Gone forever? Reminding me of things like that, I must thank you Miss, for reminding me of that ever present consistency in life: That there is no consistency. Everything changes so we can’t depend on the permanence of anything,not in our world. No way! The: “What if I get hit by a bus tmrw” challenge. Good point, your right…I do have an amazing bag of: Costa Rican Teaberry coffee beans I brought back from my trip there last Spring…Smuggled back you might say. I had it wrapped up in my long-johns so I wouldn’t have to pay Import tax and they didn’t suspect a thing. Oh man, no kidding. I can honestly say that you have never had a cup of coffee until you have had a cup of that stuff, fresh out of the grinder, right to the espresso pot, right to the cup with chilled whipping cream straight from the dairy section of the deli on the corner of W. 55th…the one owned by that Italian family where the guy’s wife pinches my cheeks and asks me when I am going too get married;..always tells me not to settle for just any ol’ “puttanesca”…if you know what I’m saying. But you, look at you furthest from that, without a doubt. Lets walk up W.50th street and pickup some honey, to take back to my place. Way better than any white sugar in a cup like that. We can grab some Biscotti too, what;s your favorite flavor?”
You to Jack, all those offers of Bonus I gave to Sasha Daygame:
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 9, 2011
381 comments
Great work Jack!
To give you more value for all the work you are doing for Sasha, you too have open invite to the same bonuses I offer to Sasha in that post…
…and if you never find yourself in Boston, able to use those offers
….You can FEEL FREE to ask anything via Facebook, leaving me 72 hours to reply…
hit up the textCell available on this site, at profile info,
or cj@thebostondatingcoach.com since that one too is the single one of many that does go to my phone directly…
all in exchange for what you do & for your immediate reply to me here!
During the short chunks of time I get to check through this Facebook personally…over what my interns post through here for me as promotional items. AGAIN I thank you good sir! ~CJ
..And yes, along with the free bonuses now available to you from this moment on, when you are here, you can exchange some time for similar like assistance in my office, (or from where you stay) in exchange for free, in field, instructional, wing/coach session or anything else I am a part of..
Also to all guys who do help our offices in this exchange, immediately qualifies them for a 10% Discount Code for Boston events, National events (NEXT ONE IN VEGAS),or another program I am personally involved in but prices are out of my control & handled by financial dept.
Yes, even I get a meager stipend to the endless hours I put into all of this, but that too is what has kept our prices maintained as lowest in the nation, for over 10 years.
HBGrant’a'wish if Wishes were Fishes, you’d catch em all day!
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 9, 2011
246 comments
“Please MISS GRANT, please allow me to thank you, please take a moment, even if ever so brief to hear me out on this…how much I appreciated ur energy in my world from years ago…then recently that energy has evolved…into one with more levels…indicating a one, or a single wavelength of energy…almost like a heartbeat… the beating, the rhythmic sensations that build up intensity with each passing moment…with each passing speck of something, that may raise said anticipation…as if pacing hallways outside waiting rooms may be felt for even the most fleeting of moments, the cool calm cucumber of avatar may wonder more inside, feeling inside. Of you is who I ask, if you might allow me the simple request, extended humbly while erect with attentive respect, that to me you Grant this request…the way on a flower a stamen eagerly awaits, while wet with morning dew, it awaits for the sun to come out for its rays of light to be near. That in which is all the bee does need in order to penetrate the petals, rubbing pollen all around as nature intended…as it does with heartbeats to bring and fill with blood, all the parts needing to be filled as the oxygen soothes the same muscles it energizes and when needed a racing heartbeat… synchronized in timing of the pulsing, that blood to finalize the chemistry needed to heal one throughout, from core to tips of fingers, tips of toes..xo.me”
Why testing new techniques is so key:
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 9, 2011
37 comments
Think of the field as a common ground for research. You, as the scientist, should go out and try new and innovative things. Try out different styles of clothes and see the reactions of other people. Try out various methods of opening and find out which style suits you. Go extreme with your actions; because if you don’t go to the extreme, you will never know where the limits begins and ends.
by Siege from his BlackBerry.
“Dude, call your boyfriend & tell him you just met a Man-friend.”
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 7, 2011
310 comments
When you get that phone number,
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 7, 2011
No comments
….. it is time for you to make [private] specific plans that is fun and interesting.
“That is so awesome we both like Latin food, we’ll have to check out that new place in Harvard Square to split an appetizer and see what they are like….”
Or whatever. Just making tentative plans will increase her likelihood to pick up the call. rather than just picking up to chat & feel like she has to be making a good impression, she has a logical reason to want to talk to you, to finalize the plans you have started to create. [/private]
Convo between man & 2 women as to why embrace masculity activates Femininity i woman, and that femininjity activates true masculinity in men
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 7, 2011
3 comments
Cj Siege
”Those times when you notice a woman that’s fully in touch with her femininity, so much that u feel it deeply, ur own masculinity rising, then she says: ‘You just ooze with sexual energy, spilling over” is one of these fleeting moments that remind you that ur truly alive” Yes it does happen regularly, to be enjoyed, but no, not every time, or with every girl, just the ones that do…. & this is a big reason why I have developed into an extremely high-qualifying, ‘top shelf only for me’ kind on man these days. Mmm……X
Like · · Saturday at 12:08pm near Boston
Michelle Terrell likes this.
Cj Siege ”American women would be better off if they spent their time understanding nature and imitating it, rather than simply blaming male dominance for their suffering and injustices. Men and women suffer equally. Suffering is relative to the one undergoing it and there is no wisdom in trying to fight with that suffering or to lay blame outside oneself” -Teachings of the Female Taoist Masters
Saturday at 1:34pm · Like
Sheila R. MacArthur Men impose more suffering on a woman who tries to gain power by acting like a man. Because of course he wins at that game — unless she totally surpresses her femininity to the point of being a freak. If she would seek power by acting like a woman, then the power balance would be equal.
23 hours ago · Unlike · 1
Cj Siege Who knows why so many women lose sight of amazing power they have as woman..in a truly embraced femininity, their natural way to be which can cause men to make large powerful descions in response to that power of a woman.
23 hours ago · Like
Cj Siege Sure we have all heard of President’s wives suggesting some of thee greatest changes throughout history..but really. Let me be honest, do you think Mark Antony conquered 1/2 of the world with Cleopatra because Cleo was trying to exert masculine power on him?
23 hours ago · Like
“Dedication is what I would bring to the learning table ” ~Student who inquired about next Vegas event
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 6, 2011
67 comments
“Hey It was great hanging out. I learned A LOT. I learned that I worry too much about what is going to happen ad how things are going to play out. The problem with this line of thinking is in many ways it prevents anything from actually ahppening. Also if something was to get started… how am I to know if its going too play out like the fantasy that is going on in my head.
Im too emotional way too quick and keep thinking about what ifs. I think If I were to focus on just chatting with a girl and not caring about an outcome or thinking of one I should be fine. I need to let go of how I have seen things play out in the past and roll int the future.
There are lots of things you have said tonight that Im hanging onto, like “You owe her as much as the time you have spent with her”. Im going to be focusing on that and what kind of mood and attitude I need to have in order to achieve talking to someone without thinking too much.
Another one of my issues is after I get the convo going… as I did tonight with Amy, I end up running out of crap to talk about.
A fix for this would be to figure out what im going to be talking about beforehand. I like what you said about get them talking and just sit back and let them talk and do all the listening.
I need to get out and practice more.
Keep me posted about what your up to….. also, Im going to look into Vegas for the weekend of the 29th. That would be a fucking blast.” ~Lestat138
About a guy many coaches called hopeless, I figured out what would get him progress:
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 6, 2011
245 comments
Siege Offline
Day GSF Organizer
****
Posts: 381
Likes Given: 41
Likes Received: 20 in 18 posts
Joined: Oct 2010
Reputation: 7
Warning Level: 0%
RE: Clear violation of the rules
(11-01-2011 06:26 PM)Serendipitous Wrote: Achilles will not find the help he needs in this community.
He’s just as guilty of antagonizing and breeding negativity as anyone else.
I move to vote him out of the community based on these reasons.
HE WILL AND HE HAS!!!
PERSONALLY I HAVE WORKED WITH HIM, from a difference in two sessions.
First was at Night GSF, where I too felt he was hopeless, and a man of suckage..
To ask for futher help like he was demanding what he expected due to him
even without any regard to help been given him by me so far.
I wrote a post about this I saw, if I can find where I post it I will put link here [URL]
He has difference to other guys like well do.
Once I learned his differences, I worked with him again, Daytime.
Through 4 sets I saw his dramatic increase in progress so well, I was thankful he asked to be video’d.
From set 1 to set 4 you can see him improving in each one based on feedback to be a completely different level of progress,, signifigantly noticed by him, and viewer and most importantly the girls he was talking to.
They became warm to him much quicker in the 4th set than the first set based on the significant difference in how he was structuring things, with video to remind him what got him those differences.
Sure we are 3.4 billion different men on this planet, each with a snowflake to our imprint.
Serendipitous Wrote:He’s just as guilty of antagonizing and breeding negativity as anyone else.
That is absolutely not true & I will have credible, variable reference to this point I make. Either quoted here or directly on the thread he is in.
Check the both if you would like to fact-check with me.
Serendipitous Wrote:I move to vote him out of the community based on these reasons.
Absolutely NOT! (Yes you may vote whatever you want, I was just stating my wholehearted disagreement with, and I will explain why)
This is a mirror image of the newbie at Night GSF (of months ago) that you moved in to his set to cockblock him and highjack set.
Your first rational to me as I asked about it, was that the girl was eye-fucking you and wanted you..
\
Does that interpretable claim seem like accurate enough reason to walk over, get in man’s set, and gum it up for him?
When I stated what I observed from an outside perspective, and regardless if what you claimed was true (although you didn’t even hook her as long as he did before you ejected him) you further that by telling me: “Well I just don’t like him”
Not only did you disregard my comments that those moves and motivations were unacceptable, so did some of the 4 other lair guys who were at Lir with us that night state to you.
After several of us were in mini-pow-wows trying to figure out the nature & rational of the moves.
With different members who were present, I was in conversations…and then from one party or the other I heard about other conversations about this same incident. (I have yet to say who, but that reason comes up later in this post. )
I continuously tried to understand what you didn’t like about this newbie since you still gave me no concrete or any reason.
Regardless of what I spent times in discussions with you, other lair guys present when that happened, and my personal reflection…
I did those things out of friendship
The thing is., regardless if I spent the time doing it for you, it STILL DOES NOT make the action right.
or acceptable from a person with a leadership standpoint.
Guys have repeatedly muffle their complaints about you out of fear of losing their membership here.
Can’t wonder too long why since some things are stated as immediate punishment without warning.
A guy under that M.O. has no chance to slip up & make a mistake then learn from it to correct his future actions..
He feels as if he walks on eggshells, and might lose something very valuable by doing something he didn’t know was wrong.er to make an judgement, or a statement of absolute before I am sure, so far the only similarity between that guy at Lir months ago & Achilles is their culture.
This is another example of why I vehemently oppose, a ‘no-mistake policy’ within the Symposium.
Men make mistakes
Men come to this group for self improvement on a variey of levels
\
Mistakes are some of the best lessons available.
For a policy, when it comes to mistakes
Let’s take breaking a rule that is written in the Symposium rules.
Every guy reads that at a different amount of careful thought through it.
Some terms used go undefined within rules. (see my post on Flaming for excellent example)
So then with a definition, each guy may make his own definition that may not agree with what is meant in rules, or how other guys interpret term (see Achilles post of Plowing) Although he had credible references to his point, guys were opposing his point, arguing what is meant, that didn’t know what the term means
[THIS POST WILL BE ADDED TO BY ME AND WILL REQUIRE A RE-READ BY MEMBERS IF IT HASN'T BEEN REPLIED TO BEFORE i FINISH MY ELABORATION OF THIS TOPIC. THANK YOU]
Sry I am only able to get to these boards once or less per day.
If for ANY reason u need/want or just would like to contact me
PLEASE feel free to to use this: (Cellphone call/text 857-544-1943 24hrs) or cj@thebostondatingcoach.com goes directly to my phone.
I see a beautiful girl nearby:
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 6, 2011
236 comments
“”Excuse me (to get her to stop) I just wanted to say thank you (pause).”
Her curiosity bells just went “DING, DING, DING!”
She’ll almost inevitably [private] ask why, though it is ok if she doesn’t. Start mirroring her some and building rapport as you continute…
“Have you ever had one of those days where, you find yourself feeling sort of aloof… you’re not really
happy, but not really sad either… you just feel like your adrift?
Then suddenly you find you bump into somebody with an incredibly warm and beautiful smile that just makes you feel wonderful for the rest of the day?”
She will almost surely smile more at this point, or give some degree of positive response. Even if she wasn’t smiling before, there it is.
As A remark to reward her smile, I will say:
“So, I just had to thank you for brightening up my day…(pause)…Though, you know it would be a shame if this is
the last time I’ll see that wonderful smile… what’s your name?”"
[/private]
Letter to inquiring affiliate,
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 5, 2011
486 comments
[Re: "I can coach in field "]
*So like all affiliates, it all starts with seeing first hand what you can bring to tables of ours before we sing you on for events.
That means, you are welcome to attend our local & national events, minus admission costs (you figure your travel & lodging) since it is an trial to see if employment/hire works for us both.
During this time, you are given opportunities to see how we operate, very structured on certain parts since been doing these things over a decade while also flexible on parts that allow it.
This to see how balance (since all ppl are different) that you work with us, our other affiliates, client guys, etc.
From then after, or during that time you are given an independent contractor hire application that includes employee/for hire handbook with requirements for you and things you can be sure of about co-affiliates/clients etc.
There is also a basic general sketch disclaimer for you to sign, basically ensuring you anonymity if you so desire & the fact that you are to keep client/affiliate anonymity etc, unless granted permission. with a few other basic points.
That is initially you are welcome to events to learn about us & we learn about you, but we all need to see how close in balance we can work with & how best we work with each other before anything else.
So yes, as you reply your thoughts to this message, I can tell you more of the available extras & bonus’s avail for affiliates in training or hire for trial period.
And of course, the last point in this message is related to the first in yours, and much appreciated:
[Re: “I really connect with your posts. Would love to know more. 
”
*Totally anything you want to know about just ask via here or skype/text/emails to phone/phone. Always love to share what I have learned so far on this beautiful journey.
I thank you
CJ
“at least they are honest about… ” even in jokes, showing no fear of reprisal
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 4, 2011
466 comments
Siege Offline
Day GSF Organizer
****
Posts: 326
RE: “Success” opener for player + wing(Yesterday 06:50 PM)Master Shake Wrote: If this helps you get over anxiety by putting the spot light on you (while you are the subject instead of the deliverer), great. But fancy openers aren’t necessary. Try using nothing but “hi” for a night. Your results will probably be similar.
You have tried this one in the field, Master Shake?
…curious, this is one I have not yet tried in field to report real life results.
yet I can see how it is a screener of sorts.
It can easily qualify/disqualify girls
based on their receptivity and interest upon what hey hear…
Never know till its tested
I’ll test this one in field, and numerous times in a night to have accurate results to report.
Amerok, remind me of it next time we’re out in field at same time
[txt 857-544-1943]
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Today, 09:24 AM
Entropy4 Offline
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RE: “Success” opener for player + wingI haven’t tested this one, but I’ve field-tested, “Hi, my name is Mark” quite a bit. 90+% success rate.
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Today, 10:21 AM (This post was last modified: Today 10:24 AM by Siege.)
Post: #8
Siege Offline
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RE: “Success” opener for player + wing(Today 08:58 AM)Siege Wrote: Never [..truly] know [..accurately] till its tested [..by ones self]
I’ll test this one in field, and numerous times in a night to have accurate results to report.
Amerok, [..if you like,] remind me of it next time we’re out in field at same time [..to see what results happen] [/size]
..and just make sure you remind me Amerok, guys in this forum have known I will test vitally anything in field, at least once.
That was a big part in how I learned what I have, testing out a million things & writing journal entries about results.
Sure I tried over 10+ time more things that gave me miserable results to further refine how things work.
I’ll never forget the time a guy I called FedAgent (withholding his real name, I forget his handle but prior lair member), told me of one me one to test at Joshua Tree, Allston.
Prior to use, I was convinced it would fail miserably, maybe even get me slapped.
So FedAgent explained it to me, and as always I said I’d test it, at least once with him to observe results, but for best accuracy, several times since some girls are not even in the mood to be greeted at times.
First group, 3 girls, I went to center one and told this story:
“Listen, my buddy just died recently and I have been caught in a dilemma…”
HBcenter was hearing me out.
“Ya, and his hott girlfriend, must be missing him terribly, since she has been…ya know….getting kinda frisky when we’re hanging out together…”
HBcenter listened as I went on.
“How long do you think I should wait before I fuck her?” and I completely shut up. Silently, I look’d at her, my eyes locked on hers expectantly.
She is looking back, maybe a whole second passes before she says:
“Why WAIT?!?”
From the instant she said that, I hugged her emphatically saying “I love you!! That is such a relief, I think you’re my new best friend, but not tomorrow, tomorrow is booked…maybe the day after though…”
The reason I gave her such a hug and said what I said, is that she detected to joke, she knew I was just kidding about the whole thing.
Sure I was mostly telling it in a serious way but with a smirking undertone to the whole thing, a bit of message sent UDR (under the radar).
While her friends (as I saw in quick side glances) weren’t getting the joke, HBcenter was clearly understanding the whole thing since I keep 95% of my eye contact, locked with hers & she could see my underlying joking frame.
By her seeing this, and hearing my UDR messages, in that way that leads to chemistry, I told her how I really felt in that moment…
Only knowing her a few minutes, I did love her in those moments at hand and loved her getting the joke we shared that even nearby people had no clue about.
Of course I had to reward that, it was how I truly felt & it was hilarious to me that we knew a joking frame that was pretty unclear to the people right next to us.
The people right next to us who heard the words, didn’t pick up on the tiny expressions I gave her to let her in on the joke.
Honestly I was a bit surprised by her reaction, I first expected hard blow-outs, or maybe even absolute disgust from a girl that I would think such a thing, no matter say it out-loud and ask somebody about it..
but once I saw the UDR communication happening, I went with it. I continued to ride the wave as I usually do when I feel those sort of things in a moment.
The guy I was with, who told me the comment, transferred to opener, he had never tested it himself but was very thankful to have seen what happened in “speed-of-life” time in front of his observation.
As I told him I would test it out a few times so he could see varied responses, I thought he would try it himself after seeing the results but when asked about it after, he still hadn’t.
But that is another reason I always say, you can read a million things about social dynamics, go to numerous seminars related, and have all sorts of coaching…
BUT unless you try things out yourself on first hand, personal basis, you never truly know.
It is that first hand experience that has you progress/grow in calibration that makes certain parts so easy, reaping wonderful rewards on regular basis Cool .
So when a guy can hear/read about new things to try out…
Ones that he never thought of before to test himself…It is fantastic to have those tools at hand available.
BUT for most accurate proof of what works, what doesn’t & the outcomes of certain things… I would recommend only using your own first hand, personal experiences.
Your personal experiences in the ‘testing lab’ of life situations is what will most accurately tell you what works best for you in M/F flirting dynamics.
Signing off Amerok, great work as usual, over & out:
“Let d”Adventure Continue!”
~C.J. “the Siege”
[txt 857-544-1943]
LINKS:
“Get Her Chasing You” and
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To enjoy the place you’re at, no matter where it is
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 4, 2011
1,135 comments
People often get a bad impression of a place for a few reasons. Here are some deflector rays to [private]those reasons:
1. Keep plowing on to dissolve the bitch shield.
The girls here are top notch, or trying to look that way. Girls dress up to their nines to be at these places. Who else is shelling out 20 bucks for a cover charge? It is very LA in that sense. Yes their bitch shields are on extra high.
I always pull high quality girls of these places. Lawyers, Doctors and girls of financial district are these places but there is a different breakdown of interaction.
Even when you see their bitch shield, you just plow on, like you didn’t notice it. Just a dirty look, a bit of a back turn, or a snide comment is built into these girls to come out automatically. By seeing you unaffected, and plowing on, they are not feeling heard yet by you so they will listen to what they have to offer.
Now you have your chance to throw a couple of stacked routines. Yes you monitor how they react, but you don’t show it. You are a good time. If they don’t pick up on it after a few of your ramble…, well, parallel to the ‘Law of Attraction’ states:
You are a roving good time. You are attracted to good times. If she doesn’t warm up and follow your positive vibe, you will notice something/somebody nearby that is in that mode (or will come up to it with you.)
Keep your good mood on & will will attract other party people anyway.
2. Once you get their high point, roll out.
There are a ton of people in the club. You are there to meet everybody, make sure you touch base with all the cool people. They have a similar mode.
Hot Bunnys will meet a bunch of guys throughout the night. Although they don’t do much to re-engage contact. (they do, but its subtle, I’ll talk about that later.) They still want to feel they did some guy-shopping through who’s around tonight.
Or more accurately, they were available to talk to guys who were ‘shopping’ as they went by.
The best way to deal with this is to open them, then plow on to get em to a high point, then be the one to cut it short. There are some great ways to do this, but once you have them engaged, its all pudding.
Are they laughing? That is one of the best high points. Stay while the laughter is high, scan around looking for your friends, then as it starts to die down, kino one of them with a hand on the arm or something and solid eye contact. “Hey, some great people of mine just got here, let me go say ‘Hi’ and I’ll come back in a bit. You HAVE to meet them, they’ll LOVE you.”
(Acting if they are the source of this high point is good too. Maybe it was your jokes, but here is a good laughter. The most wanted commodity by any jokester.)
Now turn around and walk away. Get lost in the club for a few. Open a second set of girls within sight of the first one. The second set will see you walking out of a group of girls to talk to them. They will be very eager to be opened by you.
The first set will think those are the friends you were talking about, although they are just another set of girls you stopped at to say Hi to on your way to meet up with your friends. This tells both sets, you are very preselected, socially, connected in this club.
The thing is, on the first set, even if you don’t roll into another set, you walked away while they were in a high point. As soon as you leave, they will be like “Hey, come back here, you are fun.”
Sometimes they will try to stop you, or just watch you walk away. Either way they are so easy to open after that. Later in the night, as soon as you see them, give a big smile and greet them. The first second they see you, they remember the last thought they had of you was a high point: LAUGHTER!.
For the longest time, I never understood why people had any venue that they DIS-liked. Then a buddy pointed it out to me: “We are the roving party, bringing fun to any place we go. Everyone else can either join in the fun, or sit in their nothingness and watch it go by.”
[/private]
“AMOG Issues” ~DSM
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 4, 2011
405 comments
DSmoothMike
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Yesterday, a buff muscle head tried to AMOG me by talking shit about my speech impediment. The girl gave a “fake” giggle and looked at me to see how I would respond. I smiled at him and said, “Yeah…I got a speech impediment….but at least I get laid….a lot.” The girl just bursts out laughing, slaps me on the chest and that guy just bowed down his head and frowned! Of the 3 guys there, I’m the only one who scored the number, but couldn’t pull since she had class. But now that guy knows, not to fuck with this stuttering comedian.Sure there are other ways of getting around AMOG’s, mine are just overly witty. Aside from unreactivity, what are some of your ways of overcoming an AMOG?
-DSM
D as in “Damn” Smooth as in “Butter” Mike as in “The Filippino lover!”
Four KINGPIN Trolls of www.bostonmenssymposium.com were harassing Amerok, What do you think? PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff ! (by Amerok)
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 4, 2011
49 comments
PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
10-15-2011, 11:20 AM (This post was last modified: 10-16-2011 09:22 AM by Amerok.) Post: #1
Amerok
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PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
PEN Model of Attraction
Hey guys,
Finally, here it comes. I discovered this thing 4 months ago and I’m still exploring the stuff, it goes a long way !
It is based on PEN (Psychotic Extrovert Neurotic) personality model proposed by psychologist Hans Eysenck and adapted by Adam Lyons into an attraction model, powerful shit ahead !
What is it useful for ? To calibrate your game to the girl in front of you.
There are 3 female archetypes :
Bad girl
Character : looking for strong sensations, she loves emotional rollercoasters.
Flaws : she can be unstable and/or masochists, can have “daddy issues”.
Physical : she has often tattoos or piercings. She will be dressed with crazy colors and/or motifs, very short skirt. The girl that you would call a “slut” in clubs.
Examples of archetypes : pornstar, beautician, hair dresser, etc.
Where can you find them : clubs
Party girl
Character : she wants to be seen and admired, love to be surrounded by people and in social situations.
Flaws : her diva/princess side
Physical : Anything that shines, bright colors, she wants to be noticed.
Examples of archetypes : the “party girl”, the “funny girl”, the miss who knows everybody, etc.
Where can you find them : in a group, dancing in clubs and bars with the hands up, shopping on Newburry street saturday or sunday afternoon.
Romantic
Character : She has her own world, she’s a dreamer, her place will be very personal, she’s very good at making a “cocoon” for her.
Flaws : she can be asocial, shy and castrating bitch.
Physical : Purple is their color, grey, brown, she’s trying not to be seen too much.
Examples of archetypes : the librarian, the teacher, the romantic, the artist, etc.
Where can you find them : libraries, coffee shops, AT HOME, at her friends place, etc. She will go out but she hates it.
To these 3 feminine archetypes correspond 4 masculine archetypes which are going to attract them :
Leader
Character : He likes to be in charge and gather people, he’s extroverted
Flaws : he can be bossy
Physical : Uniform, suit, tie, shirt
Examples of archetypes : the policeman, the boss, the military, the club owner, etc.
Bad Boy
Character : He likes strong sensations and he’s unpredictable
Flaws : he can be dangerous for other or himself and/or sadistic
Physical : He wears often black color
Examples of archetypes : the rapper, the biker, the weed smoker, the adventurer, the guys who drives fast cars, etc.
Bad Boy
Character : He likes strong sensations and he’s unpredictable
Flaws : he can be dangerous for other or himself and/or sadistic
Physical : He wears often black color
Examples of archetypes : the rapper, the biker, the weed smoker, the adventurer, the guys who drives fast cars, etc.
Nice Guy
Character : He’s nice and funny, connected to his emotions
Flaws : he can be needy
Physical : he’s average, looking like anybody else, the “average Joe”
Examples of archetypes : the romantic guy, the best friend, the drinking buddy, the student, the scientist, etc.
Provider
Character : He gives value by paying material stuff to others.
Flaws : That’s all he thinks he can offer therefore that’s all he offers
Physical : he has pricey clothes
Examples of archetypes : mommy’s boy, etc.
Now that we know the players, let’s have a look at ATTRACTION
Bad girl <=> Bad Boy : He’s going to give her the strong sensations she’s looking for
Romantic <=> Nice guy : he’s going to enter her bubble and reassure her.
Party girl <=> Leader : he takes her out, make her dance and meet people.
The provider is a SECOND CHOICE : if the bad girl cannot have her bad boy, she’ll take a provider rather than a nice guy. If she cannot have the sensation/emotion she’s looking for, she’ll go for : “At least he has a nice car”.
We’re all a bit bad box, leader and nice guy. We’re just these archetypes in different situations at different moment in the week or in our life. The typical transition being : teenager : bad boy => young adult : nice guy => thirty-fortyish : leader.
You can also have a combination of several archetypes in your personality : be very much of a leader with a nice guy side to it.
What can you do with these information ?
1. Know what you are ! If you are not in any of these categories : bad news, you won’t attract many women. For example : the nerd, the grumpy, etc. don’t get laid !
2. Know what kind of woman you want to attract
3. Know how and when you express your sides : Are you a leader at your job ? When going out ? Are you a bad boy when you don’t pay your tax or when you’re driving ? Are you a nice guy listening to your sister or when you make jokes with your colleagues ?
4. Now you know what side of your personality you have to develop in the case you’re attracting the “wrong” kind of girl. For instance, I want bad girls, so I have to be more of a bad boy.
5. When you’re out meeting women and let’s say you have a neurotic in front of you, don’t tell her you jumped out of a plane yesterday, it will freak her out. If you meet a bad girl don’t talk to her about your last video game. You got it : it is a matter of CALIBRATION.
This calibration depends on the location as well. Yesterday I had my black leather jacket (Bad Boy vibe) at the Lir and it doesn’t fit the place, I might meet some bad girls : I just saw two of them in the whole night. So Bad girls don’t go to the Lir. The Lir is 70% romantic girls, 20% party girls, 10% bad girl.
Finally, the tests she’s going to through at you will be calibrated around what she’s looking for : the neurotic will try to see if you’re caring and the bad girl will try to see if you have balls (field-tested).
If you find a girl who’s shit-testing you hard, you can almost right away tell she’s not a neurotic. Apart if she’s telling you : me and my friends would like to stay alone. This means that you entering her bubble is too much.
The power of this model is that it is good for a natural game, you just have to express the right side of you at the right moment.
Enjoy ! Any feed-back welcome.
Soldier of Love.
We bring Love.
Only Love.
What is this thing about, again ?
10-15-2011, 12:11 PM Post: #2
Serendipitous
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Honestly, this sounds like marketing to me. My crazy psycho ex possessed just about all of those qualities. I don’t think it’s as easy as this. There are plenty of girls I know that don’t fit into either of those. Plus, I think at least 2 out of the 3 listed female “types” are derogatory against women.
November 20th Symposium – equilibrium – Emotional Dimensions of Dating & Seduction
10-15-2011, 12:27 PM Post: #3
Entropy4
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Sounds like a piss-poor rip off of DiCarlo’s Pandora’s Box system. Pandora is really interesting and actually based on psychological research as well, but this kind of stuff is not very applicable in field at all.
“Your favorite guru’s favorite guru.” – Doc
www.PracticalPickup.com — Largest source of free dating and pick up advice on the internet.
Get a Girlfriend, Guaranteed Online Coaching Program
PickupTube.net — 7+ hours of infield footage
10-15-2011, 12:42 PM Post: #4
Grim
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
I agree with the comments above. Sounds like more pointless guy crack. Modeling types of women and then trying to somehow change your game based on the type of women is both more work than you need to do and largely the wrong type of work. Approach each women as if she is completely unique and make the interaction about learning about her. It’s much better than going in with predetermined ideas about people.
It’s more useful to try and determine what type of girl turns you on and what type of girl you are compatible with. It’s the best way to have healthy interactions with women. Approaching should be an exercise in determining if you and the girl you are talking with would make a good match.
These types of models are not bad for guys to learn about if they are newbies and even to go out and do some learning, but with good calibration they aren’t needed at all.
BTW – I am both very nerdy and very grumpy. Nerds and geeks tend to hang out and meet each other. I love nerdy girls!
10-15-2011, 01:19 PM (This post was last modified: 10-15-2011 01:31 PM by Amerok.) Post: #5
Amerok
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Too bad, there is no value for you guys in there . I hope some guys out there will be able to find some in it !
Peace, Love and Harmony !
PS : I think my english messed up, by “nerd” I meant “the asocial guy with dirty clothes and hair” ! By “grumpy”, I meant “negative, always arguing guy”.
PSS : I do use this everyday and I used it to pick-up the last chick I made love with.
Soldier of Love.
We bring Love.
Only Love.
What is this thing about, again ?
10-15-2011, 02:03 PM (This post was last modified: 10-15-2011 02:10 PM by Seven.) Post: #6
Seven
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-15-2011 11:20 AM)Amerok Wrote:
Psychotic
Examples of archetypes : pornstar, beautician, hair dresser, etc.
I laughed out loud.
10-15-2011, 02:51 PM Post: #7
Grim
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-15-2011 01:19 PM)Amerok Wrote:
By “grumpy”, I meant “negative, always arguing guy”.
I’m pretty negative – so is Gordon Ramsey, Donald Trump and Steve Jobs.
(10-15-2011 01:19 PM)Amerok Wrote:
PSS : I do use this everyday and I used it to pick-up the last chick I made love with.
Most likely this helped you by getting you out to meet more women. It gave you confidence that you could go out and meet this type of women. The other side is, could someone ignorant of this model also pick up women – the answer is yes. Men have been having sex with women for thousands of years. Can a guy who doesn’t go out and who doesn’t meet women or had the confidence to believe he could get with her pick her up – no.
It would seem to me like this acts much like a placebo. Much of PUA stuff does. It’s not useless, but when you do this for a long time, you start to see this pattern emerge.
The following 1 user Likes Grim’s post:1 user Likes Grim’s post
Seven (10-15-2011)
10-15-2011, 04:31 PM (This post was last modified: 10-15-2011 04:32 PM by Amerok.) Post: #8
Amerok
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Grim you’ve got it all wrong. But I have better stuff to do than just try to convince you guys. I shared something with you and you think it’s shit or give you confidence to meet women (by the way, did you read that is about calibration ?) that’s fine.
Peace !
I wish you the best with women !
Soldier of Love.
We bring Love.
Only Love.
What is this thing about, again ?
10-15-2011, 04:50 PM Post: #9
Grim
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-15-2011 04:31 PM)Amerok Wrote:
Grim you’ve got it all wrong. But I have better stuff to do than just try to convince you guys. I shared something with you and you think it’s shit or give you confidence to meet women (by the way, did you read that is about calibration ?) that’s fine.
Peace !
I wish you the best with women !
Come back in a few years and tell me if you still think this is a magic bullet. Three of the most experienced guys on this Lair don’t see this system as holding much merit.
Calibration is not something you can plan for. You can’t hold a model of it in your head. It’s done in the moment. If this system helps you, then go for it, I’m not saying it’s bad for you.
10-15-2011, 04:56 PM Post: #10
Seven
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-15-2011 04:31 PM)Amerok Wrote:
Grim you’ve got it all wrong. But I have better stuff to do than just try to convince you guys. I shared something with you and you think it’s shit or give you confidence to meet women (by the way, did you read that is about calibration ?) that’s fine.
I agree with serendipitious, some of it is just degrading. You might get laid this way (it seems you have) but you’ll never make a real connection. This formula will make you more superficial and one dimensional than you really are, not to mention the girl.
Calibration is ideally about improvisation, not formula, and expressing different, but real, sides of yourself.
10-15-2011, 05:17 PM (This post was last modified: 10-15-2011 05:22 PM by Entropy4.) Post: #11
Entropy4
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Pick up is an organic and emotional process that is unique from interaction to interaction. There are a million ways to slice it up and label the process. Each way you choose slice it up and analyze it is going to be imperfect and therefore have its own strengths and weaknesses.
Yes, this model helps you spot personality traits and teaches you to calibrate to them. But it also limits and stereotypes behavior unfairly and in the long-run will hurt connection and relationships.
I see a model like this very much the same way as I see routines. If they help you, that’s great, use them. But the idea is to get to the point where you don’t need it anymore. Because many of these tools that help you early on, are the same tools that hold you back later.
But you are right, we should thank you for sharing something that’s been helping you. Although next time I’d be a little more careful about plastering words like “powerful” all over it. I think that’s probably what elicited such negative responses from the senior guys. Because in the end, Grim is right, it’s a placebo. And right now it’s working for you. Learn what you can from the experiences and then move on without it. Every interaction is unique. Every woman has an endless spectrum of emotional needs and desires, and the only way you can begin to react to them appropriately is by observing and feeling them yourself. Not by reading about them.
Best of luck.
“Your favorite guru’s favorite guru.” – Doc
www.PracticalPickup.com — Largest source of free dating and pick up advice on the internet.
Get a Girlfriend, Guaranteed Online Coaching Program
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Seven (10-15-2011)
10-15-2011, 06:07 PM Post: #12
Serendipitous
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
I wonder which of those categories Adams wife falls in…
November 20th Symposium – equilibrium – Emotional Dimensions of Dating & Seduction
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Dicky Wifebeater (10-15-2011)
10-15-2011, 06:50 PM Post: #13
Drifter Miles
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
This shit is only powerful stuff for you because of your nearly illogical belief in it.
It’s not a bad thing if you’re just looking to get laid.
It is a bad thing if you’re planning on having any sort of real relationship with a woman in the future.
Hi, my name is Drifter and if the above post offended you in any way, shape or form, please send me a PM and simply request a post removal and I’ll be more than happy to oblige, you tight little vagina, you. ^_~
PM me about… The Rape Method Program – The fastest, cheapest, most convenient way to get laid available to you today for a specially discounted price of only $5999!
10-15-2011, 08:23 PM Post: #14
Amerok
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Guys,
I really think there is a huge misunderstanding, I do not see where it is, so I cannot recover. But apparently the way you view it and the way I am doing it and using it like 180° apart.
It’s sad, but that’s the way it is. It’s like we’re talking about two different things. I am not using it the way you guys seem to think. Serendipitous has seen me in-field and he knows I’m a genuine person who loves women.
So unfortunately, I think this thread was a hit and miss ! Too bad !
Ok, I’ll try anyway one last time. How do I use it ?
I use it for cold reading. It’s not a magic trick or nothing, it’s just that our personalities are somehow limited (I know I’ll get some reaction on this, remember we’re on a forum I cannot explain in depth my thinking). When I say it gets me laid, it doesn’t. It just helps me to know who I’m dealing with. That’s it !
But your over-reactions of all of you (I do not get one feed-back on my progress, which I need and get 10 answers in this thread saying I’m saying shit ???) show me I touched a sensitive spot ? Crazy, I don’t understand ??? Is it because i said “Adam Lyons” ??? Should have I said “Judy Garland” ? Is this a war or something ?
So I know it is disturbing for some people, but yesterday I cold read a woman who obviously an extrovert in front of joe and he can witness that she was quite impressed that I could know so much about her.
Then another girl I guess she’s in art, etc. I do this every day. Whatever, I’ll guess you just don’t care. I don’t mind !
I know that you are judging me on that and I have to say that I’m quite disappointed about this on a self-improvement forum. I thought it was a community and that we were supposed to help and support each other, and not AMOG one another, I do not get nothing out of all your comments, except that you’re pissed off.
You guys are just using the same intuition-based reading on girls and people but maybe it’s not rationalized, it does not come from Adam Lyons or you don’t want to admit it. Whatever, this is your thing, not mine.
By the way, if it goes into the “more experienced guys don’t agree on this, so it is bullshit”, then once again I would say I am quite disappointed since I don’t like cock size contests, I have to say.
Whatever, I think I’m out of this thread : too much NEGATIVITY, I’ll let you guys continue to bury it ! You’re good at it ! Would it be that you all are bad boys ?
Peace anyway !
Amerok
Soldier of Love.
We bring Love.
Only Love.
What is this thing about, again ?
10-15-2011, 08:49 PM (This post was last modified: 10-15-2011 09:14 PM by Seven.) Post: #15
Seven
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
dude, this is not a personal attack on you.
everyone here is supportive and wants you and everyone else here to improve with women and generally at life.
one of the main things we learn here is how to communicate better. if a bunch of senior guys reacted the way they did you have to look at why that is, and how you can communicate better.
take some time and look back at old posts. this is far from the first time someone has posted on cold reading or calibration short cuts. there have been many in depth discussion on the topic, look at those before posting.
you came in with an attitude like your dropping a bomb of awesome “powerful” wisdom on everyone, and it came off either arrogant or misinformed.
yes you say in this last post that it is only a minor extra helper for you to cold read, but that’s not what you said in the original post. if you really like this stuff i would check out the pandoras box thing that entropy mentioned.
——————————————————————————–
and dont feel discouraged, im sure its shitty and depressing to feel like your being singled out and bashed by all the big guns, but thats not whats happening here, the bashing is of the model, not of you. no one will remember this at all if you give them something else to remember you by.
Empty your mind. Be formless, shapeless, like water. If you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle and it becomes the bottle. You put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Now, water can flow or it can crash. Be water my friend. – Bruce Lee
10-15-2011, 09:09 PM Post: #16
Serendipitous
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
No one is shitting on you Amerok. We’re just giving you our opinions of the model you posted about.
November 20th Symposium – equilibrium – Emotional Dimensions of Dating & Seduction
10-15-2011, 09:40 PM Post: #17
Grim
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Yeah man, this is not a personal attack. Each post I made I took the time to say that if it works for you keep doing it. Or that it’ll be helpful for newbies. But it is not the end all of it all.
You presented this information and I believe you expected us to all agree that it is as powerful as you think it is. Well we all have different opinions. Many of the experienced guys, myself included, tried models like this and it may have helped, it may not have. But when we disagree, please separate our opinions from who we are. My guess us you are disappointed we don’t share your enthusiasm for it. No reason to hate us.
Learn to be a little less reactive. No one is judging you.
10-15-2011, 10:16 PM (This post was last modified: 10-15-2011 10:18 PM by Drifter Miles.) Post: #18
Drifter Miles
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
I am going to attack you, purely for fun now. ^_^
(10-15-2011 08:23 PM)Amerok Wrote:
I really think there is a huge misunderstanding, I do not see where it is, so I cannot recover.
So you spend the next few paragraphs trying to recover?
Quote:
It’s sad, but that’s the way it is. It’s like we’re talking about two different things. I am not using it the way you guys seem to think.
It doesn’t really matter what we think.
If it works for you, it works for you.
If it works for you, there shouldn’t be a need for you to be so emotionally charged in defending it.
I do a lot of shit that classical pickup would totally frown upon, but you know what? It doesn’t matter, because I make it work through my own human ingenuity.
Quote:
So unfortunately, I think this thread was a hit and miss ! Too bad !
Once again, if it’s too bad, why are you trying to do this Mystery Method backturn shit?
Why are you explaining below if it’s such a lost cause to bring this to the table?
Quote:
Ok, I’ll try anyway one last time. How do I use it ?
I use it for cold reading. It’s not a magic trick or nothing, it’s just that our personalities are somehow limited (I know I’ll get some reaction on this, remember we’re on a forum I cannot explain in depth my thinking). When I say it gets me laid, it doesn’t. It just helps me to know who I’m dealing with. That’s it !
Then why did you claim that this is POWERFUL stuff?
Quote:
But your over-reactions of all of you (I do not get one feed-back on my progress, which I need and get 10 answers in this thread saying I’m saying shit ???) show me I touched a sensitive spot ?
No, but your post clearly shows that we touched a really sensitive spot.
Your clitoris.
Seriously, dude. You need to make up your mind. Are you a resolute man who sticks to his beliefs like you try to present yourself to be? Or are you someone who needs everyone’s support in order to feel fulfilled?
Quote:
So I know it is disturbing for some people, but yesterday I cold read a woman who obviously an extrovert in front of joe and he can witness that she was quite impressed that I could know so much about her.
Then another girl I guess she’s in art, etc. I do this every day. Whatever, I’ll guess you just don’t care. I don’t mind !
That’s fantastic that you can cold read. It should be a part of everyone’s skillset to be playful with women and interact with them in a frank and honest manner. However, that’s not what your POWERFUL STUFF was about.
Quote:
I know that you are judging me on that and I have to say that I’m quite disappointed about this on a self-improvement forum.
Uhh, pretty sure everyone shit all over this PEN Attraction Model. Look, everyone has a different style. I shit all over Mystery Method just a few days ago. It’s okay to have an opinion about a pickup style. It’s okay to have a perspective about it. It’s okay to share it. However, it’s not okay to get all butthurt over something that you didn’t even have a hand in developing.
Quote:
I thought it was a community and that we were supposed to help and support each other, and not AMOG one another, I do not get nothing out of all your comments, except that you’re pissed off.
If you’d get off your emotions for a second, you’d realize that you’re the one who’s offended, here. Nobody took a shit on you. Now you’re accusing EVERYONE of being pissed off. Sounds like you’re projecting, man.
Quote:
By the way, if it goes into the “more experienced guys don’t agree on this, so it is bullshit”, then once again I would say I am quite disappointed since I don’t like cock size contests, I have to say.
Is it because you’d quite obviously lose, just like you’ve been doing throughout this thread? lol, j/k obviously, but on a serious note, anyone who just blindly follows another person’s method or tactic just because they’re experienced or even famous like Adam Lyons (oh man, my throat is itchy, lemme clear this shit up real quick.. ahem.. AHEMEROK! okay, all better.) is just a lemming.
Quote:
Whatever, I think I’m out of this thread : too much NEGATIVITY, I’ll let you guys continue to bury it ! You’re good at it ! Would it be that you all are bad boys ?
Peace anyway !
Amerok
You think you’re so cute, hiding all those butthurt emotions behind winking smileys.
Nobody is asking you to change your methods. Nobody is poking their dried talcum powdered dick into your soft and delicate sphincter. I don’t know if it’s because english is your second language (it’s my second too, btw, lmaobbqwtf) or if you just have a weird attachment to this model, but you’re seriously misunderstanding what’s going on in this thread.
Go back and read what people are saying AFTER you detach yourself from this strategy.
Also, just because this is a self improvement forum, it doesn’t mean we all have to constantly suck each other’s dicks. People need their beliefs challenged in order to change it or solidify it.
Hi, my name is Drifter and if the above post offended you in any way, shape or form, please send me a PM and simply request a post removal and I’ll be more than happy to oblige, you tight little vagina, you. ^_~
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10-15-2011, 11:14 PM (This post was last modified: 10-15-2011 11:15 PM by Action.) Post: #19
Action
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-15-2011 10:16 PM)Drifter Miles Wrote:
(oh man, my throat is itchy, lemme clear this shit up real quick.. ahem.. AHEMEROK! okay, all better.)
I lol’d
personally having gone through pandora’s box and such I find this kind of stuff to be way to hard to remember to apply in field. It might have some value after the fact if your thinking about starting a ltr I imagine possibly. But on pure cold approach I notice it just adds a whole other wall of thoughts.
I go from “oh shit hot girl” -> open
to “oh shit hot girl” -> “…wait, does she dream about the future?..” -> “oh fuck, shes wearing purple…wait what does that mean again??” -> ahh forget it/open (but way shittier cause i’ve been in my head a bit)
No one is knocking you, your a chill guy. BUT to be fair, you did sort of have a similar reaction when I was in field with you and these girls were like “really?! no way! your not from switzerland” kinda shit testy, kinda playful and you were sorta like “WHAT! FUCK YOU BITCHES LETS GET OUT OF HERE” haha.
The following 1 user Likes Action’s post:1 user Likes Action’s post
Seven (10-16-2011)
10-15-2011, 11:26 PM Post: #20
Drifter Miles
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
lol, I went back and read some of the posts I didn’t read and I saw this.
Quote:
But I have better stuff to do than just try to convince you guys.
Oh, Amerok, you clusterfuck of conundrums, you. <3
Hi, my name is Drifter and if the above post offended you in any way, shape or form, please send me a PM and simply request a post removal and I'll be more than happy to oblige, you tight little vagina, you. ^_~
PM me about... The Rape Method Program - The fastest, cheapest, most convenient way to get laid available to you today for a specially discounted price of only $5999!
10-16-2011, 07:37 AM (This post was last modified: 10-16-2011 08:01 AM by Siege.) Post: #21
Siege
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Hey Amerok, great night out.
& I do see how a good portion (but not all) of your model even related to the tables of girls on either side of where we sat.
But yes, as I somewhat explained, the vocabulary that has come from your translation of Swiss-French to English might get negative conotations as first impression.
(10-15-2011 12:11 PM)Serendipitous Wrote:
I think at least 2 out of the 3 listed female "types" are derogatory against women.
You Amerock, Dean (lived in Switzerland, speaks Swiss-French) and myself should all pow-wow together soon and we'll help you to reword your post to have a better understandable value for more readers on these boards.
Until then, Let d"Adventure Continue, Ttyl.
~CJ
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Quick EditFull Edit
10-16-2011, 09:07 AM Post: #22
Dean
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Lol, I get the "you can't be from switzerland" all the time, at least you've got an accent. It's a small country, so even in a place as diverse as Boston, they're not many swiss here. Plus while switzerland may be known for it's cheese, chocolate, and banking, there are no well known stereotypes about the swiss here, so people don't know what to expect. Either way, I've never found the initial skepticism to be a barrier.
About these models, if we're looking at psych profiles, why not go for the real stuff like the myers-briggs scale? But in my experience, the best thing to go off in an interaction are your own instincts and impressions. The human mind is the most powerful modeling software at your disposal. By putting girls into categories, you risk ignoring or dismissing the most interesting part of a woman, the side of her that doesn't readily fit into a box
drunkenpickup.blogspot.com
10-16-2011, 09:25 AM (This post was last modified: 10-16-2011 10:20 AM by Amerok.) Post: #23
Amerok
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
I'm back due to the nice feedback from CJ : Thanks for your feedback, man ! I corrected with "bad girl", "romantic" and "party girl", maybe a cultural/language thing.
Dean : I think you're misunderstanding me, I try to get to know everyone on a deep level I love to connect. I do not say : "She's a bad girl so she's only so and so". In my mind it goes like "she is mostly bad girl, so she LIKES the EMOTION of excitement and likes very dominant men", it is just one more information about her like the place where she grew up, her passions, the type of sport she does and so and so.
If you see a girl who runs, swims and do 3-4 more sports, you will make a mental category for her that she likes sports and from there, using the association principle (social psychological shit) you will attribute her certain attributes, some of which will be true, some of which will be wrong (the "halo effect" is the association principle at work). For example, if you say to her : "You like sports, so you like to take care of your health". This will be true for a certain percentage of them, if I had to guess, I'd say the majority. But for some of them, it will be : the pleasure of endorphins in their brains, being in the nature, feeling the power of your muscles, losing weight, teamplay, etc.
And this is where I'm happy to be wrong. I try to kill my prejudices (and this is why I love meeting people and travelling), so when I do a cold read and guess someone, it is very good to be wrong, then I get to feed my intuition with new information and get to know the girl better. It's just like when you see a girl and in your mind something negative comes (she looks like a slut), I go to her to get to know her. Don't get me wrong, I don't pretend to be a psychic or something, it's just a fun game to me to try to guess as many things from a person as I can without the person telling me. Some social artists are into magic tricks, some are into storytelling, I am into understanding from where people come from and what they are looking for in life.
Regarding the categories, this is just how your brain work, otherwise you could not process all the info out there. You're keeping some information and leaving most of it. Have a look at "categorization social psychology" in a book or on google (haven't found any good resources online, I took classes on this), so whatever it is : people or objects, you're filtering out some information. This is where stereotypes come from.
It is useful to know stereotypes because they make you gain time in some situations. However, I know that they are ONLY stereotypes, I've been in Brazil and I've been friends with a pretty nerdy guy who could not dance and seduce girls. He was feeling like shit, because the majority of brazilian guys in the village where I was (hence the stereotype) were good at both. And it is the same in every culture or group.
Here is some more info on the PEN model anyway :
http://www.personalityresearch.org/pen.html
Quote:
Causal Aspects
Extraversion. The PEN model is biologically based. Extraversion is based on cortical arousal. Arousal can be measured by skin conductance, brain waves, or sweating. While theoretically introverts are chronically overaroused and jittery, theoretically extraverts are chronically underaroused and bored. The theory presupposes that there is an optimal level of arousal, and that performance deteriorates as one becomes more or less aroused than this optimal level. The finding that arousal is related to performance as an inverted U-shaped curve is called the Yerkes-Dodson Law.
Extraversion is related to social interest and positive affect. Some investigators have proposed that social interest causes positive affect, since the best of times are usually those spent with other people. However, Diener and Larsen (1993) have found that this hypothesis is incorrect. Another alternative is that positive affect causes social interest, since being very enthusiastic and fun loving may make people want to go out and be with other people. This hypothesis has not yet been studied. Yet another possibility is that a third factor causes both positive affect and social interest. Dopamine responsivity, which makes people highly sensitive to reward, may be the factor responsible for both positive affect and social interest.
Neuroticism. Neuroticism is based on activation thresholds in the sympathetic nervous system or visceral brain. This is the part of the brain that is responsible for the fight-or-flight response in the face of danger. Activation can be measured by heart rate, blood pressure, cold hands, sweating, and muscular tension (especially in the forehead). Neurotic people, who have a low activation threshold, experience negative affect (fight-or-flight) in the face of very minor stressors--i.e., they are easily upset. Emotionally stable people, who have a high activation threshold, experience negative affect only in the face of very major stressors--i.e., they are calm under pressure.
It is interesting to note that measures of activation are not highly correlated. That is, people differ in which responses are influenced by stress--some sweat, others get headaches. This is called individual response specificity. It is also interesting to note that stressors differ in the responses they elicit. This is called stimulus response specificity.
Psychoticism. Psychoticism is associated not only with the liability to have a psychotic episode (or break with reality), but also with aggression. While less research has been done on Psychoticism than on Extraversion and Neuroticism, the research that has been done has indicated that Psychoticism too has a biological basis: increased testosterone levels.
In order to draw causal conclusions, researchers on the PEN model have not been content to use only correlational research methods such as factor analysis, but have gone further and used experimental research methods. These methods have been used not only on humans, but also on non-human animals such as rats. (Isn't it interesting that Eysenck believes even rats have personality--with the same three dimensions as humans?!)
It's just a tool, don't take it personally.
Soldier of Love.
We bring Love.
Only Love.
What is this thing about, again ?
10-16-2011, 09:47 AM Post: #24
Entropy4
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Well, that's better. But my point from my most recent reply still stands.
"Your favorite guru's favorite guru." - Doc
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10-16-2011, 10:08 AM (This post was last modified: 10-16-2011 10:10 AM by Amerok.) Post: #25
Amerok
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Maybe I forgot to explain something from wikipedia :
Quote:
In psychology, an archetype is a model of a person, personality, or behavior.
A model is not real life, I know it guys, don't worry.
BTW : my offer for (constructive and/or positive) feedback on my progress still stands. Anytime !
Love you ! Smack !
Soldier of Love.
We bring Love.
Only Love.
What is this thing about, again ?
10-16-2011, 10:28 AM Post: #26
Serendipitous
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-16-2011 10:08 AM)Amerok Wrote:
BTW : my offer for (constructive and/or positive) feedback on my progress still stands.
http://bostonmenssymposium.com/forum/sho...p?tid=7066
#2.
November 20th Symposium - equilibrium - Emotional Dimensions of Dating & Seduction
10-16-2011, 10:42 AM (This post was last modified: 10-16-2011 10:42 AM by Entropy4.) Post: #27
Entropy4
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-16-2011 10:08 AM)Amerok Wrote:
Maybe I forgot to explain something from wikipedia :
Quote:
In psychology, an archetype is a model of a person, personality, or behavior.
A model is not real life, I know it guys, don't worry.
BTW : my offer for (constructive and/or positive) feedback on my progress still stands. Anytime !
Love you ! Smack !
I think you're still missing my point. But my constructive feedback is already there, if you want to read it.
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10-16-2011, 10:54 AM (This post was last modified: 10-16-2011 10:56 AM by Amerok.) Post: #28
Amerok
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Hey Seven,
Seven, I read your answer right now but not all the other from others , I do not like emotional poison I have to say. Sorry man, but I don't think people were supportive at all. I did not even read the answer where the guy takes one hour of his time just to trash me.
I agree about communicating better, this is why I wrote more on it. The thing is people start over-reacting : "I'm like : whoa ! what's happening ?". That's cool that other people had a look at cold-reading and stuff before me, I did not want to sound arrogant or stuff. It IS powerful for me in my life and it does not work 100% of the time, it's just a tool.
I might be misinformed, since you know I'm trying to improve and learn JUST LIKE EVERYONE. This is why I was very sad of the way people reacted. If I am just a newbie who needs guidance and enlightenment, as I said : you are most welcome.
The thing I did not like is people criticizing something they have not even TRIED, which means I cannot trust what they're saying. They did not even experimented it.
It's like someone saying : "Guys I found this new ice cream mint with chocolate chips, it's awesome !". Does it sound like arrogant or misinformed ? Then some guys : "It is shit, I already tasted mint and it sucks", another "I tasted chocolate and it's the real deal". Well, I'm talking about something else. If I share it with you, maybe there's some reasons, don't you think ? Try it and then you can tell me I don't like it. Not this is shit (non-violent communication). Then I will not feel attacked.
Anyway you are right, I can always improve my communication, I know I may sound arrogant sometime. I have to work on that.
BTW : I already use the Pandora's box model. I use these two models to complement each other for calibration. I hope it does not sound arrogant or misinformed ?
If I should be communicating better, I'm not the only one. You say I'm taking this personally, but this is how I felt about you guys.
(10-15-2011 08:49 PM)Seven Wrote:
dude, this is not a personal attack on you.
everyone here is supportive and wants you and everyone else here to improve with women and generally at life.
one of the main things we learn here is how to communicate better. if a bunch of senior guys reacted the way they did you have to look at why that is, and how you can communicate better.
take some time and look back at old posts. this is far from the first time someone has posted on cold reading or calibration short cuts. there have been many in depth discussion on the topic, look at those before posting.
you came in with an attitude like your dropping a bomb of awesome "powerful" wisdom on everyone, and it came off either arrogant or misinformed.
yes you say in this last post that it is only a minor extra helper for you to cold read, but that's not what you said in the original post. if you really like this stuff i would check out the pandoras box thing that entropy mentioned.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
and dont feel discouraged, im sure its shitty and depressing to feel like your being singled out and bashed by all the big guns, but thats not whats happening here, the bashing is of the model, not of you. no one will remember this at all if you give them something else to remember you by.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Serendip and Entropy : I'll have a look at what you wrote. I got angry on this thing.
Soldier of Love.
We bring Love.
Only Love.
What is this thing about, again ?
10-16-2011, 11:35 AM (This post was last modified: 10-16-2011 11:36 AM by Grim.) Post: #29
Grim
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-16-2011 10:54 AM)Amerok Wrote:
Then some guys : "It is shit
Please drop this. No one said it was "shit." You keep putting words in peoples mouths. It is not going to help you or make people want to help you. You are making a mountain out of a mole hill.
10-16-2011, 01:33 PM (This post was last modified: 10-17-2011 12:28 AM by Seven.) Post: #30
Seven
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Listen man, I'm quickly losing interest in this bizarre debate.
What I'll say to you is the same thing I said to another guy in a thread about his troubles with some religious girl. MOVE ON, its not fucking worth it, your getting stuck in a rut of your own making. Nobody will remember this (including you) if you just roll with the punches and keep going.
The fact that people are supportive here doesn't mean they're gonna like everything you say, it means there is an overall theme of constructive criticism toward the goal of self improvement for everyone involved. If you feel guys were too harsh, then work on communication with siege and whomever else you like so you can learn how to elicit the type of responses your looking for.
The one thing ill respond to in your last post is you claim people are criticizing a model they've never tried, but if you read carefully lots of guys told you they've tried shit that's very similar, and the thing you posted is really just not that original. sorry. fact. also models of any kind should be used mostly as training wheels and this is pretty much an agreed upon principle not only here but universally. also fact.
Tom Brady's offense is so great not because its based on a model (a ridiculously complex one at that), but because he is so practiced and skilled that he probably never thinks about that model anymore, he just goes with his instincts. His greatest asset is situational awareness. The model was simply Charlie Weis' (his first nfl coach) way of bringing him along when he was still a total nube. Now he changes plays on the fly just by looking at a guy a certain way.
don't get defensive because something you say is criticized here. do you react the same way when a girl criticizes you? You just end up looking like a douche. I sincerely hope you take this as a learning experience and like i said MOVE ON.
If you wanna talk more PM me.
Empty your mind. Be formless, shapeless, like water. If you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle and it becomes the bottle. You put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Now, water can flow or it can crash. Be water my friend. - Bruce Lee
10-16-2011, 02:28 PM Post: #31
Serendipitous
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Calm down guys. Everyone means well.
Guys, Amerok isn't from Boston or even the U.S. He isn't familiar with how our community disagrees with a lot of what some people consider "the word".
Amerok, no one is attacking you personally, these guys are just offering their opinions because you asked for feedback. If it works for you, keep using it.
November 20th Symposium - equilibrium - Emotional Dimensions of Dating & Seduction
10-16-2011, 08:31 PM Post: #32
Seeker
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
I wanted to say a quick thanks to Amerok for sharing. He found something that worked for him in field and took the time to share it and try to add value to the group. I think that is commendable.
It was also valuable to see other people's thoughts on the model. I find that even if I don't go all in on a particular model, there can be nuggets of truth that remind me of things I should be doing.
Here I was reminded that I should pay attention to the girls to whom I'm speaking (novel idea, right ?). Even if not classifying anyone a certain way, Amerok's model reminded me sometimes I'm thinking about what I'm saying so much that I'm not as situationally aware of who's in front of me as I should be.
I also smiled at the idea of the "bad boy" and thought I need to be more like that . Again, apart from any model this was valuable about reminding me I need to get more comfortable expressing my sexuality and leading. So that was an interpretation that added value for me, irrespective of the overall model at hand.
So again, Amerok, thanks for sharing.
10-16-2011, 08:40 PM Post: #33
Seven
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
I hope its implied that we appreciate people sharing here, and if its not obvious, then ill be explicit. sharing is what this is all about. without sharing this is nothing. thank you to Amerok and everybody for sharing.
The point here is you cant do that effectively if your overly sensitive to peoples reactions. nobody is gonna constantly suck your dick just for sharing, the growth comes from hearing people talk straight, without holding back. You gotta learn to take criticism for what it is.
In my short time ( and i dont even claim to be a senior guy really, barely intermediate at best) i have noticed that perhaps one of the biggest epiphanies any guy can have is that moment when they realize they don't have to be defensive about shit. Go with the flow. take perceived negatives and turn them in your favor. Be like water.
Empty your mind. Be formless, shapeless, like water. If you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle and it becomes the bottle. You put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Now, water can flow or it can crash. Be water my friend. - Bruce Lee
10-16-2011, 09:06 PM Post: #34
Drifter Miles
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-16-2011 10:54 AM)Amerok Wrote:
Serendip and Entropy : I'll have a look at what you wrote. I got angry on this thing.
lol, you've been angry since like post number 2, homie.
Hi, my name is Drifter and if the above post offended you in any way, shape or form, please send me a PM and simply request a post removal and I'll be more than happy to oblige, you tight little vagina, you. ^_~
PM me about... The Rape Method Program - The fastest, cheapest, most convenient way to get laid available to you today for a specially discounted price of only $5999!
10-16-2011, 09:18 PM Post: #35
Dean
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-16-2011 08:40 PM)Seven Wrote:
The point here is you cant do that effectively if your overly sensitive to peoples reactions. nobody is gonna constantly suck your dick just for sharing, the growth comes from hearing people talk straight, without holding back. You gotta learn to take criticism for what it is.
In my short time ( and i dont even claim to be a senior guy really, barely intermediate at best) i have noticed that perhaps one of the biggest epiphanies any guy can have is that moment when they realize they don't have to be defensive about shit. Go with the flow. take perceived negatives and turn them in your favor. Be like water.
I think this is the most valuable thing that's been said in this whole thread. Having the right mindset is far more useful, in pickup and life, than having the best model. For example, Amerok mentioned the post he was being "trashed" in, referring I assume to Drifter Mile's post. When I saw that post I thought it was a hilarious a good natured teasing.
I've been on the boards for a bit and I really enjoy how we rip on each other. If it's taken as a personal attack, that's more of a reflection on you than anyone else here, assuming you're not posting a 5-some story. Being defensive means you give a shit about others opinions of you and are taking disagreement as a personal attack. Girls don't find that attractive and it's a very reactive way to be.
I would have much rather seen the thread go like this:
Amerok: I has a model
Other guys: cool, but I has better way
Amerok: that's cool too
End of thread
When how it played out was more like:
Amerok: I has awesome model, mwahaha!
Other guys: your model cannot beat my tiger style!
Amerok: my model is awesome, how dare you not acknowledge?
Other guys: Amerok, you act butthurt
Amerok: Am not
Other guys: Are too!
Amerok: Am not and fuck y'all for dissing my contribution
And so on...
drunkenpickup.blogspot.com
10-16-2011, 09:30 PM Post: #36
Drifter Miles
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
lol, I'm still wondering how he knew if it was trash talk if he didn't even read it.
BUSTED~
Hi, my name is Drifter and if the above post offended you in any way, shape or form, please send me a PM and simply request a post removal and I'll be more than happy to oblige, you tight little vagina, you. ^_~
PM me about... The Rape Method Program - The fastest, cheapest, most convenient way to get laid available to you today for a specially discounted price of only $5999!
10-16-2011, 09:32 PM (This post was last modified: 10-16-2011 09:39 PM by Seven.) Post: #37
Seven
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
I would have much rather seen the thread go like this:
Amerok: I has a model
Other guys: cool, but I has better way
Amerok: that's cool too
End of thread
When how it played out was more like:
Amerok: I has awesome model, mwahaha!
Other guys: your model cannot beat my tiger style!
Amerok: my model is awesome, how dare you not acknowledge?
Other guys: Amerok, you act butthurt
Amerok: Am not
Other guys: Are too!
Amerok: Am not and fuck y'all for dissing my contribution
And so on...
Dean
this is fucking hilarious. well done sir.
Empty your mind. Be formless, shapeless, like water. If you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle and it becomes the bottle. You put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Now, water can flow or it can crash. Be water my friend. - Bruce Lee
10-17-2011, 12:30 AM Post: #38
Siege
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
I wrote an extensive post to this, but the draft didn't save for me to come back to finish it. Wierd new web odule or something.
Anyways, wht aI had mentioned most & I will post now until I retype the other is
Drifter Miles Wrote:
"Absorb what is useful, discard what is not, add what is uniquely your own." - Bruce Lee
HALLOWEEN/VEGAS Coach/Wing Wknd BONANZA!!!
You too, stay at Project Vegas Mansion w/ 4 coaches incl. PM/Txt 4 info. 3 left
[txt: C.J. "The Siege" @ 857-544-1943]
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Quick EditFull Edit
10-17-2011, 12:33 AM (This post was last modified: 10-17-2011 01:16 AM by Seven.) Post: #39
Seven
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
if anybody is interested this is my favorite "method of seduction"
this works every time. then i make my exit like this
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i run this every saturday night.
Empty your mind. Be formless, shapeless, like water. If you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle and it becomes the bottle. You put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Now, water can flow or it can crash. Be water my friend. - Bruce Lee
The following 1 user Likes Seven's post:1 user Likes Seven's post
Dangles (10-21-2011)
10-17-2011, 10:42 AM (This post was last modified: 10-17-2011 10:51 AM by Seven.) Post: #40
Seven
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
I looked back and realized this whole thing might have more to do with being "lost in translation" than i thought. I underrated the fact that Amerok is new in this country. That part is a much easier fix than learning to be less reactive, which is also an issue. Lets chalk this up to experience and move on. you cool amerok?
Empty your mind. Be formless, shapeless, like water. If you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. You put water into a bottle and it becomes the bottle. You put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Now, water can flow or it can crash. Be water my friend. - Bruce Lee
10-21-2011, 12:58 PM (This post was last modified: 10-21-2011 01:13 PM by Amerok.) Post: #41
Amerok
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Hello,
I took some time to read again what all you guys wrote, but I was needing some time to take perspective, at the time I really felt this like a personal attack which made me very uncomfortable as I expressed it above. So I needed some time to recover emotionally from this event since I really felt bullied on this forum for not thinking like everyone else. I am not trying to victimize myself in anyway, just explaining my feelings at the time. I wanted to be accepted and did not feel like it, I had some need of approval deep inside me which I don't have any more, thanks to you fuckers ! (joke inside)
In the first place, I wanted to share something with you which helped me a lot for my social reading skills. It was not well welcomed and I accept it. I understand as well that there is a norm here that people new people don’t know nothing (I live it in my lab), I don’t agree and this is largely based on the association principle again. Everybody has something to bring to the table. If this is not the thing I can bring on the forum, I’ll try something else. In the meanwhile, people interested to talk about this model in real life will see me at GSFs and lair meetings.
I'm going to answer everybody :
Serendipitous
I said that everybody has these three aspects in him, read again. I never said it was simple, I just said it is a key that I use to read the emotions people are MOSTLY looking for at the moment I meet them. There are 3 aspects to that : what they show, what they are deeply and what they hide. Some can align, some won't, this is where it becomes an art to guess what they're craving for mostly as an emotional vibe.
Quote:
I wonder which of those categories Adams wife falls in..
You seem very concerned with Adam Lyons and his wife. Too bad she's taken, man !
Entropy4
Quote:
this kind of stuff is not very applicable in field at all.
I understand it's not for you, it's fine !
Quote:
I see a model like this very much the same way as I see routines. If they help you, that's great, use them. But the idea is to get to the point where you don't need it anymore. Because many of these tools that help you early on, are the same tools that hold you back later.
But you are right, we should thank you for sharing something that's been helping you. Although next time I'd be a little more careful about plastering words like "powerful" all over it. I think that's probably what elicited such negative responses from the senior guys. Because in the end, Grim is right, it's a placebo. And right now it's working for you. Learn what you can from the experiences and then move on without it. Every interaction is unique. Every woman has an endless spectrum of emotional needs and desires, and the only way you can begin to react to them appropriately is by observing and feeling them yourself. Not by reading about them.
I am just reading this part now, so you might be right that's it's working against me in some cases but it helped me understand why I could never attract some types of girls. We should talk about it live, it's getting too complicated. If you think I'm making three categories and putting every people in it, that's just not the way I'm doing it and interacting with people, not at all. I am very curious about the complexity in every person I meet, man or woman. BTW : I did not read about it, it was just a video which I posted (that nobody watched apparently). I am at where I am right now, and it helped me to better understand (I'll say it once again) the EMOTIONS some people are MOSTLY looking for. That's all this model is all about.
Grim :
Quote:
It's more useful to try and determine what type of girl turns you on and what type of girl you are compatible with.
This is exactly what it is all about. And being compatible with a girl is a choice based on life choices not a finite state.
Quote:
Approaching should be an exercise in determining if you and the girl you are talking with would make a good match.
I never said the opposite.
Quote:
good calibration they aren't needed at all.
This is what it's all about calibration, view it as a compass showing only 3 directions if you want, not as a 40'0000:1 map.
Quote:
BTW - I am both very nerdy and very grumpy. Nerds and geeks tend to hang out and meet each other. I love nerdy girls!
This is exactly what states this model, what you call a "nerd" I call it a "nice guy" or a "romantic", that's all.
Quote:
Three of the most experienced guys on this Lair don't see this system as holding much merit.
This is called Authority principle of influence, man ! Don't fall into this trap ! If you want to know more about it, read "Obedience to Authority" by Stanley Milgram : eye-opening.
Quote:
You presented this information and I believe you expected us to all agree that it is as powerful as you think it is. Well we all have different opinions. Many of the experienced guys, myself included, tried models like this and it may have helped, it may not have. But when we disagree, please separate our opinions from who we are. My guess us you are disappointed we don't share your enthusiasm for it. No reason to hate us.
I do not hate anybody, but you're right I was very enthusiastic and got very disppointed when no positive reactions went back to me (apart from Seeker).
Seven : since we'll meet in-field I'll make you a demo (for free ) and explain it better. I'm respecting every women as individual, if I would do or think something degrading I would feel bad and I would be off-track, which I'm not.
Quote:
don't get defensive because something you say is criticized here. do you react the same way when a girl criticizes you? You just end up looking like a douche. I sincerely hope you take this as a learning experience and like i said MOVE ON.
If you wanna talk more PM me.
I'm just reading this right now. No I don't react like this when I'm not tired, out-phased or drunk.
Quote:
In my short time ( and i dont even claim to be a senior guy really, barely intermediate at best) i have noticed that perhaps one of the biggest epiphanies any guy can have is that moment when they realize they don't have to be defensive about shit. Go with the flow. take perceived negatives and turn them in your favor. Be like water.
Yes, man ! I agree, I like this "Be like water" thing, I have some work to learn to be less reactive and less needy of approval (whether girls or guys).
Drifter Miles :
Quote:
This shit is only powerful stuff for you because of your nearly illogical belief in it.
It's not a bad thing if you're just looking to get laid.
It is a bad thing if you're planning on having any sort of real relationship with a woman in the future.
Not at all, it's powerful for me because I'm challenging this model, thinking about it, making links between concepts in psychology and my life, past and present. I already had quite a few relationships with women (some might say I'm in one right now), so do not worry too much for me, it has nothing to do with over-simplifying peopled
Quote:
Your clitoris.
Seriously, dude. You need to make up your mind. Are you a resolute man who sticks to his beliefs like you try to present yourself to be? Or are you someone who needs everyone's support in order to feel fulfilled?
Stop fantasizing about me, man ! I know you like it but I'm not into this shit. On a more serious note, you are right I still need too much other people's approval.
Quote:
Is it because you'd quite obviously lose, just like you've been doing throughout this thread? lol, j/k obviously, but on a serious note, anyone who just blindly follows another person's method or tactic just because they're experienced or even famous like Adam Lyons (oh man, my throat is itchy, lemme clear this shit up real quick.. ahem.. AHEMEROK! okay, all better.) is just a lemming.
Now You're projecting (I agree I did it before I was blinded by emotions). I don't follow blindly someone because he's an authority (like on this forum) I just found something that explained to me lots of things about humans and the kind of EMOTIONS they're MAINLY looking for.
Quote:
Also, just because this is a self improvement forum, it doesn't mean we all have to constantly suck each other's dicks. People need their beliefs challenged in order to change it or solidify it.
I agree ! (I thought I had a clitoris, I'm confused ? )
Quote:
Oh, Amerok, you clusterfuck of conundrums, you. <3
I don't understand this slang ? Anyway, like I said looking back I went head over heels.
Quote:
RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
lol, I'm still wondering how he knew if it was trash talk if he didn't even read it.
I really WAS lost in translation, It's like I was drunk or something, perceiving a distorted reality, looking back to it, it feels strange to me. Dean was right, I was being very defensive and reactive to my new environment, like when you change an animal (a cat for instance) from one apartment to another. It's over now.
Quote:
I looked back and realized this whole thing might have more to do with being "lost in translation" than i thought. I underrated the fact that Amerok is new in this country. That part is a much easier fix than learning to be less reactive, which is also an issue. Lets chalk this up to experience and move on. you cool amerok?
Yeah, I'm cool now. Thanks for caring ! You were the one that understood the best the state I was in. I was quite confused and defensive, as I said earlier it's over, it was pain period for sure.
Seeker and Siege
Thanks for your honest support, I can see you understand the thing better since I could explain it to you in real life and you got to know me. I'm also trying to EXPRESS more the bad boy in me. Like Boom !
To everybody :
At the moment I wrote this post, I was lost in translation experimenting cultural shock. I was also working too much and lacking sleep. So I was reactive, looking back and reading at your posts I don't see at all the aggression I saw these past days. This is why I stopped to write : I knew that I was needing some perspective on this. So just know that I read most of your comments only today (10/21/11).
Knowing better the social and cultural context, I should have taken into account two things using social intelligence :
- I should not have used the word "powerful" in your culture it has connotations such I'm trying to sell you something (for my own interest) or know better than you => immediate reaction.
- I should not have quoted Adam Lyons, for several reasons I won’t expose here.
I prefer to meet people in real life so I hope we get to meet each other at a GSF or a lair meeting. I want to say thanks to all of you for participating in this post and pointing to me that I have to work more on the emotional management, non-reactivess, less needing approval and acceptance (as well as alcohol and sleep management ). I’m waiting on this “emotional intelligence” book to arrive, looking forward to it. Thanks also to for noticing that I was genuinely trying to bring value to the group.
Peace !
Amerok
PS : Let me know if something is not clear yet !
Soldier of Love.
We bring Love.
Only Love.
What is this thing about, again ?
10-21-2011, 01:20 PM Post: #42
Grim
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-21-2011 12:58 PM)Amerok Wrote:
Quote:
Three of the most experienced guys on this Lair don’t see this system as holding much merit.
This is called Authority principle of influence, man ! Don’t fall into this trap ! If you want to know more about it, read “Obedience to Authority” by Stanley Milgram : eye-opening.
I wrote and directed a whole movie based on the Milgram Experiment.
It’s online for the month of October if you are at all interested in watching it.
“There is a difference to saying I am an authority so blindly follow me” and I “I have more experience and my experience speaks differently.”
In the first case, the authority has an agenda it wants you to pursue, in the second, we simply want you to avoid the pitfalls we ourselves fell into.
This whole post smacks of mental gymnastics to prove your point. Go out, meet 20 women and tell me how successful this model is. Remember you have to also blame all of your failures on it as well.
10-21-2011, 06:37 PM Post: #43
Serendipitous
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Amerok, you know we’re cool face to face, unlike some of the other guys posting which you have never met, and I’m going to have to say that in your last post, you are still being very reactive.
My comment about Adam Lyons wife was meant to imply that there is a paradox in his model. His model comes off as negative against women, no matter what terms you use to describe women, and I was trying to call attention to the fact that he must not view his wife in the same light as the girls in his own model. Why would he marry a girl with any of those traits? Most logical answer is she doesn’t fall into one of those categories.
When you said you took some time to think, IMHO, you didn’t take enough time and you’re thinking about things in the wrong way. You could have asked yourself “Why would Matt make that comment? What did he mean by it?”. Without thinking about those things, you came up with your own conclusions and you are still dismissing people’s comments.
Don’t try to think of rebuttal’s for people’s comments, because it’s not going to lead towards your growth. Think about what they really mean before posting a reply.
~S
November 20th Symposium – equilibrium – Emotional Dimensions of Dating & Seduction
10-22-2011, 12:09 AM (This post was last modified: 10-22-2011 12:09 AM by Drifter Miles.) Post: #44
Drifter Miles
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Quote:
I don’t follow blindly someone because he’s an authority (like on this forum) I just found something that explained to me lots of things about humans and the kind of EMOTIONS they’re MAINLY looking for.
Really?
I was talking about you blindly following this Adam Lyons guy’s model.
Way to call everyone here a lemming.
If you know so much about interactions and these “yes, but” games, look this one up on the internet.
It’s called “being a passive aggressive bitch”.
Hi, my name is Drifter and if the above post offended you in any way, shape or form, please send me a PM and simply request a post removal and I’ll be more than happy to oblige, you tight little vagina, you. ^_~
PM me about… The Rape Method Program – The fastest, cheapest, most convenient way to get laid available to you today for a specially discounted price of only $5999!
Yesterday, 09:49 PM (This post was last modified: Yesterday 11:01 PM by Amerok.) Post: #45
Amerok
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
Thank you Serendipitous ! And I understand that you mean well for me, man ! Even through my stubbornness.
Let’s agree on not agreeing on this model, ok ?
I know you’re intelligent and you know I am, so we don’t have to agree on it to be friends. This thing does not matter to me, it’s ok.
To be honest with you, many times in my life there has been something that brought me good things and I wantd to share it with people. So I try and sometimes succeed to convince them that it is good (hence the feeling you got of me trying to sell you something), so it’s not the first time that I upset people by being stubborn about sharing something they’re not interested in. I know it works for me, that’s all I need to know : I won’t back off just to please someone, even more a friend, it would be a lie.
It’s recent that I learned that you share by doing and showing, not by saying or argue.
May the Peace be with all of you !
Copying Edison : “It’s not that I found no way to communicate with people, I just found a hundred ways not to communicate with them !”
Soldier of Love.
We bring Love.
Only Love.
What is this thing about, again ?
Today, 11:26 AM (This post was last modified: Today 11:33 AM by Siege.) Post: #46
Siege
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RE: PEN Attraction Model : Powerful Stuff !
(10-15-2011 04:50 PM)Grim Wrote:
Three of the most experienced guys on this Lair don’t see this system as holding much merit.
To which a post from another THREAD comes to mind:
Master Shake Wrote:
Ego is definitely a problem, but just because someone just signed up here doesn’t automatically make them a newbie.
Maybe they were in another lair for a while.
Maybe they have done this on their own and have a lot of experience. Just because your join date is older doesn’t make you better than any one.
Great points Mr Master Shake, along with your other two points, ego’s lesser half can sometimes be seen running rampant in places like this.
It is also something I continously work on to keep in check within myself.
Yes the balance does get easier as time goes on, but it is also responsible for flame that never seems to fully go out.
Thank You
~C.J. “The Siege”
.
HALLOWEEN/VEGAS Coach/Wing Wknd BONANZA!!!
You too, stay at Project Vegas Mansion w/ 4 coaches incl. PM/Txt 4 info. 3 left
[txt: C.J. "The Siege" @ 857-544-1943]
LINKS:
VEGAS HALLOWEEN Wing/Coach WKND
And
FREE Dating/PUA Instruction
Facebook d’Adventures HERE
RE: Looks do matter
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 4, 2011
431 comments
When asked what they looked for in a potential date, most college students put “physical attractiveness” at the bottom of their list (A. Tesser & M. Brodie study) but that came out is what the students felt they ought to believe.
In many studies in social psychology, opinions of first dates were overwhelmingly influenced by another person’s physical attractiveness. Elaine Walster & associates did a study matching students of a university for blind dates.
Before any of the dates, the students were given personality tests to see what characteristics led to future dates with the same people as the blind date was with. Intelligence, masculinity, feminity, dominance, submission, dependance, independence, sensitivity, sincerity, etc. were al measured yet physical attractiveness was the one determinant of the couple liking each other and planning a second date.
BEWARE – DO NOT FLIRT (its way to good for your health)
Posted by Clark C.J. (♥♥♥) "Siege"
on December 1, 2011
575 comments
So you’ve mastered the art of eye contact and can beckon a romantic prospect with just a few coy glances… but do you really know all there is to know about the fine art of flirting? Just to make sure you’re up to speed, we culled some very surprising information that you can use to your advantage. Read on for some juicy tidbits that may up your meet-cute quotient in no time.
1. Flirting is good for you. Studies show that people who flirt have higher white blood-cell counts, which boost both immunity and health.
2. Think batting your eyelashes is enough? Wrong! All told, scientists say there are 52 “flirting signals” used by humans. Of these, the hair-flip technique is the most common.
3. In some places, flirting is illegal. In Little Rock, AR, an antiquated law is still on the books warning that engaging in playful banter may result in a 30-day jail term. In New York City, another outdated law mandates that men may be fined $25 for gazing lasciviously at a female; a second conviction stipulates the offender wear a pair of blinders whenever he goes out for a walk.
4. Why wait for Friday? Lots of people get their flirt on during their morning commute. A full 62 percent of drivers have flirted with someone in a different vehicle while on the go, and 31 percent of those flirtations, it turns out, resulted in a date.
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A longtime friend, former wing/roommate once was flirting via hand signals & sign nlaguage. This was car to car, visual in traffic. He ended up getting her number and dating for a short time. She would travel over an hour to come see him.
5. Flirting need not occur face to face. According to the Pew Research Center, 40 percent of people who look for love online say they can easily flirt with someone via email or IM.
6. In the Victorian era, fans were the ultimate playful props that could communicate all sorts of messages. A fan placed near the heart meant “You have won my love.” A half-opened fan pressed to the lips was an invitation, saying, “You may kiss me.” Hiding the eyes behind an open fan meant “I love you,” while opening and closing the fan several times was a chastisement, implying, “You are cruel.” Given how much a fan could come in handy, it’s a shame they ever invented air conditioning.
7. These days, cell phones do the flirting for you. In one survey, half of all mobile phone users have texted flirty messages to keep things interesting while separated from their loveinterest.
8. Watch out; you can overdo it. According to the Social Issues Research Centre, the most common mistake people make when flirting is maintaining too much eye contact.
9. Sometimes, flirty gestures aren’t what they seem to be. Research has shown that men tend to routinely mistake friendly behavior for flirting.
10. Flirting is universal. A woman living in New York City and one in rural Cambodia may not have much in common, but when it comes to attracting a little attention, they both employ the very same move: smiling, arching their eyebrows, then averting their gaze and giggling. Animals flirt, too: birds, reptiles, and even fish have their own way of making romantic advances. The moral of the story: If the simple sea bass can act cute in order to further a romantic agenda, you can, too — so give it a go!
Come to find out, Thursday is the night that has the highest frequency of meeting a new person & hooking up on first meeting.
